Well I'm finally getting sick of messing with the gen1 system, just about ready to swap over to the gen 2's. Finding a donor car will be difficult, BUT there might be an 87 in a yard an hour south of here. Is there a list of all the parts I need off the donor car? And do the new motors bolt right up to the old headlight assemblies, or do I need to get those from the donor car too?
You will only need the motors and the entire front harness (don't forget the modual behind the fender) but if you can take the buckets too, you might as well take those as well.
It is well worth the swap, before; having the older motors, I was always asked "what was THAT!?" whenever I operated my headlights.
Now, you can't even hear them go up while driving, and they don't sound like they are going to blow up.
Anyways, with the swap, it is a lot easier to swap the harness when the hood is removed. Scribe marks on the hood bolts to insure proper allignment. If you loose the allignment, take out the headlight buckets, remove the headlight doors, then with all the adjusters loose, close the hood and adjust where needed, tighten the bolts through the headlight door orfice.
Once complete, take the time to clean the headlight connectors, they usually get pretty bad, fix up and cracks or openings in the wires and apply new electrical sealant to the connectors.
Hope this helps!
Matt
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12:06 PM
NotAFieroAnyLonger Member
Posts: 4413 From: 75762/Texas/USA Registered: Dec 2003
I know you need the module under the driverside fender-----the wiring harness under/in the front compartment----light assemblies-----ummmm----or just the motors--- Not sure what else, but this is a start right..??
Steve-- SmoothGT--
------------------ Choptop WideBody GT 1 of 1 4.9L-V8-Auto---almost finished
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12:08 PM
Knight Rider Member
Posts: 418 From: Saint Augustine, FL USA Registered: Jul 2001
There is an excellent write up about converting to the Gen II headlights in Ogres Cave (link at the top of the page). From there go to the electrical section, then select the lighting. From there you should find the GEN II headlights. The second half of the article details what parts are needed and how to install them.
as the parts needed for the swap, and it looks like you can buy them all new except the Headlight and dimmer switches. Are these the same switches on the left side of the insturnment cluster, or some other parts?
The Cave also says you can use the harness from a Sunbird or Firebird, are they the SAME harness, or what modifications are required (besides the up/down wires being different)?
You don't use the whole harness from the alternate cars. Just the motor wiring and and the large module plug with enough wire to splice it to the Fiero. Along with the motors and module from the donor. You have to carefully cut wrapings and whatnot to free the needed wires from the motors to the module. You want to free enough wire with the big module plug that you can splice it, around a foot of wire if you can get it. That way you can stagger your splices to avoid a big knot that will be hard to hide.
The parts list is just that... a general parts list. Those are the numbers you want if you are ordering new parts. Even if you ordered new parts, you would need the motor to module wiring and the big plug to splice to the Fiero harness.
------------------ Dr. Ian Malcolm: Yeah, but your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn't stop to think if they should. (Jurasic Park)
One more thing you might want to grab when you get the motors. Take the bolts that hold the motors to the headlight bucket. The bolts are a little shorter than the ones on the gen 1 motors. The gen 1 motor bolts will protrude farther in and catch the operating linkage. Or you can cut off the longer bolts to clear the linkage.
Max
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11:51 PM
Nov 10th, 2005
ly41181 Member
Posts: 1013 From: The Vill of Hodgens, ky Registered: Sep 2002
Someone had said that if you take the headlight system out of an 87-88 fiero you had to take the coolent fan relay to because it has a different connector from the one used on older Fieros. Its that true? I've got an 84se and want to try this.
Sweet! Now, what do i need other than the fan and the coolent fan relay. I know that when I turn on the air that the fan also kicks on as with the 84's. Will that affect it or do I need it really?
Thanks! Josh
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12:59 AM
PFF
System Bot
GT86 Member
Posts: 5203 From: Glendale, AZ Registered: Mar 2003
As far as installing, it's a piece of cake. Unplug the old harness from the bulkhead, the connector is by the brake booster. Remove the turn signal and marker light housings, as well as the bulbs. Unplug the harness from the headlights, motors, master cylinder, radiator relay and Fan, horns, and disconnect the plastic retainers that hold the harness to the frame. There's a few of these, but they're easy to get to. Then just pull the old harness out. My original harness had been hacked by the previous owner, so I didn't care if it survived or not. That made the pulling a bit quicker. Might take you a bit longer if you plan on saving the old harness.
It's easier to change the motors with the bucket out of the car. Unbolt the buckets from the car, and remove the bucket/light/motor as one unit. The buckets are attached to the car with four nuts. The bottom two don't have to come off the studs, as the mounting tabs on the bucket have slots. So you just need to remove the top two nuts and loosen the bottom two enough to pull the bucket up and out. Take off the old motors and install the new ones. The Gen 2 motors bolt up without any modifications. You can also take the old relays off the buckets. Not essential, but you don't need them, so might as well ditch them.
While you've got the buckets out, route the new harness. This for me was the most time consuming part. The only real pain is that the harness is routed between the hood hinges and the frame. I didn't remove the hood, I just scribed marks on both hinges for alignment, and disconnected one at a time. My wife held the hood while I routed the harness, then I reattached the hinge, unbolted the second, routed the harness, and reattached the hinge. A little faster than taking the hood off completely. Just make sure to check the hood is aligned correctly, and that it opens, closes, and latches. Pretty easy, just remember to make those scribe marks before you unbolt the hinges.
Once the new harness is in, install the radiator fan relay, re-install the buckets and hook everything up. On 87-88 Fieros, the control module is under the driver side fender. I didn't pull the fender when I swapped my system over, I just found a temporary place to mount it by the driver side headlight. I knew I'd be pulling the fender a few months later, so I moved it to the factory location then.
It took me about 3 hours, but I also did some cleaning and repainting while I was at it. Probably take an hour or two if you are just pulling and replacing parts.
Definetely worth it! The Gen 2 motors are much quieter and smoother, and are easier to rebuild as well.
edited to add: obviously, disconnect the battery before you start pulling anything
[This message has been edited by GT86 (edited 11-10-2005).]
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08:27 PM
Nov 11th, 2005
ly41181 Member
Posts: 1013 From: The Vill of Hodgens, ky Registered: Sep 2002
Hey thanks GT86. I'm stripping a 87 gt right now and i'll take the headlight system out of it. Is there anything else on the car that will work in my 84se other than the radiator fan?
Attached is the paper written by "Sketch" several years ago about how to convert to Gen 2 lights using the wireing and controller from a Firebird/Sunbird. I used this information to rewire my 1st Fiero. it is really easy.
Max
If you find and 87 or 88 Fiero in a junkyard, you can (relatively) easily convert your headlights over to the new system. This requires changing the entire front wiring harness. Remove it where it connects to the bulkhead near the power brake booster, and disconnect the wires from the windshield washer pump. Move to the front (headlight area), and you will have to remove a lot of wire holders, and electrical connectors on all of the lights and the coolant fan motor. Remove the headlight motors, and the control module, which is located on the outside of the frame, just below the driver's side front marker light (in front of the wheel well). You will also need the coolant fan relay (in front of the driver's side headlight), because it has a different connector from the one used on older Fieros. Now take all of that, and put it in your car. Instant (well, almost) 87-88 style headlights.
On the other hand, if you're handy with a soldering iron, you could just take the motors and control module, and wire it up to your existing system. If you do this, you could use the motors and control module from an 87 or later Firebird instead (may be easier to find).
I did this on my car, and here is the schematic for the headlight wiring which is now on my car. The original wiring is on the left, and the new wiring is on the right. The "dots" are the points at which I soldered the wires together.
what if you dont have the wiring harness for the gen 2?
Get it. Or you can try rewiring like Max posted, but having done the conversion, I'd say just replacing the wiring harness was considerably easier than what he said. You can't use the Gen 1 harness, the connectors and relays are wrong.
Again.... you don't need a complete harness for the front of the car. It's actually allot of work that way and can cause complications on some models.
You can do it like the drawing shown just above. I'd avoid that myself just because I like to avoid joints in wires. At the least you'd still need all the correct plugs.
As covered in my cave... if you can get the donor wiring from the motors to the module, you avoid joints. (These wires do not have to come from a FIero.) These wires can be carefully taken from any car with the Gen 2 lights. You'll also need the large plug for the module with enough wire for splicing. This plug will be spliced into the front harness IN PLACE OF the Gen 1 relay system. You can remove all the Gen 1 parts from the car.
Another reason to use the method I just described is it preserves the two speed radiator fan on cars that have it. The Gen 2 harness will not support the 2 speed fan and you'll have to replace the fan with a single speed motor or mod the existing one.
I was planning to (have a mechanic) do the Gen 1 to Gen 2 headlight switch and change clutch pedals. However, it appears that both of these might be really tedious (i.e.: expensive) to do. I don't drive my Fiero much, so I'll probably just say the hell with all the bother!
