The engine on my silver car (2.5L/Auto) will move at the touch of a finger. It's been slamming into gear and otherwise kicking the **** out of itself so I rebushed the dogbone with poly (it sucks if you have the later dogbone since you need to hand fit the bushings which is tedious). Now the car vibrates like a Harley in Drive at a stop sign as it strains against the dogbone! So I figure the lower engine mounts are getting old so I put her up on jackstands and pulled the mounts.

Sure enough, the transmission mount is getting old - looks like it's had a long life of getting the **** kicked out of it on a continual basis. So I hop on line and my local Kragen has one in stock for 13 bucks or so. So I'm like "Sweet!" and go to buy one. Turns out that the part looks just like the one for my 87GT Getrag! That's not right... We couldn't for the life of us locate the correct mount! We searched the whole engine mount catalog, and the picture that seemed to match my transmission mount wasn't mentioned in ANY of the GM applications in the book! Huh? Nobody else had the part either (they all came up with the same part - for the M/T). Turns out the Fiero Store has them for 40 bucks apiece.

This is the best part though. I then examined the front engine mount - this one appeared to have had the greatest amount of **** kicked out of it. It was pretty hammered. "Oh, ok" I say, it shouldn't cost much for a front engine mount, they must be pretty common. It turns out that the engine mount the 86 and 87 Automatics use is a special mount that costs 140 bucks! SH***T!! They don't even MENTION a front engine mount for my car at the local parts stores. But 84 and 85 4 banger autos, 86 and 87 4 banger manuals and the 85-87V6 all use a different mount that costs 32 bucks! What's up with that?!

My question is this - is my only option to open the wallet and deal with it, or can I use a mount from a different year? It figures that my car would happen to have bad engine mounts that also happen to be the hardest to get and most expensive as well. Has anyone managed to use different year mounts? Is there any mods required, or will one bolt in place of the other? Thanks in advance...

-Chris

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Chris

Blue 1987 GT Getrag 5 speed, 1" lowering springs, 225 50R16 rims and tires, Fiero Store 9 3/4" HD clutch (Soon to be 3.4L DOHC powered!)
Silver 1986 2m4 THM 125c automatic
Black 1985 2m4 SE Isuzu 5 speed (no paperwork)

The tranny mount part can be obtained using Ankor part# 2543. The part books all say front and rear which is typical common V-6 applications. That part is for the two mount system the 4 cylinders use.
The engine mount is a choice of two, one is a fluid mount (&&) and the other solid. I do not have part #s for them but if you like I can locate them for you along with a price. LMK

TTT
This thread didn't dissappear, it was on the next page.

I agree about the mounting of these things. Its like they were thinking, "ok, lets place two mounts in the middle that the engine can pivot on, Oh, and we'll just add a dogbone on one side to hold everything in place. And to make things easier, we'll just slot the dog bone bracket!" Its a horrible design. I've seen plenty of dogbones beat to hell, along with those mounts, even broken dogbone brackets. A lot of the 'junk' cars you see floating around have the throttle cable bracket thing smashed into the rear trunk because of this, darn GM.

One thing you may consider is adding torque straps to the side of the engine. We added them along with new mounts on an SE here, and really helps prevent the motor from 'rocking' too much, even with a good dogbone. It should help keep some of the stress off of the mounts too, prolonging their life.

If its something you're willing to consider, you can update the mounting to the V6 style. You need to ditch that big 'case' bracket that surrounds the side of the tranny and find two of the metal V6 brackets. You can then use two $12 rubber mounts rather than that one center mount. This will help control the movement as well, saving you from wearing that expensive front mount.

I've never really spent time to look at a 4cyl mount, but I wonder why you couldn't use a cheaper V6 rubber front engine mount. I know for a fact that the two bolts that stick up INTO the 4cyl U bracket are the same spacing and the V6 will mount to it. I don't know if when you mount this bracket to the cradle if the engine will then be tweaked or not. I'd imagine, that even if its off a bit, you can redrill the cradle mounting bracket for the right spot, or slot the holes slightly and use strong washers on the underside of the cradle.

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--1986 SE V6, Wild Custom Notchback --For Sale Click Me!
--1984 SE Modified Notchback

D'oh! I guess my post wasn't lost at all. I swear I like, looked for it for 30 min to no avail... I need to start getting some sleep or something! Thanks DRA.

Anyways, I was expecting a setup not unlike my V6 car - two simple mounts on the transmission, one on each side, and one front engine mount on a simple mount, then the dogbone. As a matter of fact, even the parts stores all show the M/T tranny mounts when I'm looking for the Auto mount for this year - the part I'm looking for is nowhere to be found except for the Fiero Store. Oh yeah, thanks for the part #, Indiana + for you. Gonna have to check that out... The parts person at Kragen and I found a part in their catalog that looked identical, # Anchor 2783 - funny part? None of the GM vehicles in the book, Fiero or otherwise spec'ed that part (wtf?). Needless to say I didn't go out on a limb to order one, but I'll have to check this part # out.

It's as if they want a good deal of play on purpose - maybe to take up slack when the auto shifts or something? Seems like a prescription for a busted up dogbone, which is exactly what I got, which caused my lower mounts to fail, which is why I'm here complaining about the design and price of engine mounts in the first place!

Jncomutt - that's exactly what I was wondering - just what's different about the V6 front engine mount? If it'll hold together under my abusive clutch dumping on my V6, then it should be fine for the duke. Fiero Store says that the same crazy expensive part they use on the 86-87 Auto duke is the same as the 88' V6 and it's U shaped bracket. But I wonder if the 85-87V6 front engine mount will go in the same holes with some tweaking (or perhaps none at all?). I'm going to take a look into it and see if it can be done - I think the 84 and 85 auto 4bangers DO actually use the same mount as the 86-87V6, according to the application notes at the Fiero Store and all. I think maybe I'll pull my front mount, and go compare it to a V6 one and see...

BTW, out of curiosity, question for anyone that knows: Is the 86-87 4Cyl/Auto and 88V6 front engine mount that "liquid filled" mount that I've heard someone mention or is that the "driveline absorber" that the V6's use? What exactly does a liquid filled mount do, anyways?

quote Originally posted by Blue Shift: The parts person at Kragen and I found a part in their catalog that looked identical, # Anchor 2783 - funny part? BTW, out of curiosity, question for anyone that knows: Is the 86-87 4Cyl/Auto and 88V6 front engine mount that "liquid filled" mount that I've heard someone mention or is that the "driveline absorber" that the V6's use? What exactly does a liquid filled mount do, anyways?

I have not checked that particular part (that I recalll) but will take a peek at it later this week if time allows. It might look the same in the picture but the studs are spaced and offset differently.

The driveline absorbor is a small shock that mounts on the side of the V-6 engine block facing the front of the car located on the passenger side and is not a mount. (gas filled) The liquid filled mount supposedly will dampen the more abrupt engine torque quicker than the solid rubber mount. I have found them easier to trash than the rubber ones and don't use them.

I did some trial fitting. The V6 mount WILL allow you to mount the 4cyl bracket to the cradle. I put the engine trans together using all V6 parts. It works, and its pretty solid. Whether or not the engine is level and correctly oriented, my eye is unable to tell, but it physically fits and can be bolted together.

Well I'll be damned, + for you Jncomutt. What year car did you do your test on, 86? I'm going to "borrow" a mount and test fit it and see how it works - if it comes out level for me, that's what I'm doing! It'll be cheaper, and if it lines up ok, it should be fine if it holds the 6, I figure. Not like the engine can move even .25" after putting poly in the bone.

They do use the V6 style mount on 84-85 4bangers (auto and manual both, I think) so maybe it's only the front mount that changed (I hope), and the bracketry is the same - which would be cool.

Once more for clarification, if I may - is the 86-87 Auto 4 Cylinder/88'V6 front engine mount actually liquid filled? Is that why it's so pricy? I think mine has gooey oily crap on it, but I thought it was leaking oil from the motor.

I feel your pain. I have an '87 SE 4-cyl auto, and had the same problems finding engine/tranny mounts.

However, I was able to find the bottom engine mount (the solid one) at a local parts store. I paid about $80 for it! I would avoid the liquid-filled mount, as it's weaker than the solid one.

I had the same problems finding a tranny mount. I eventually gave up and bought one from the Fiero Store.

Jncomutt: Which car did you swap the mounts on? Now I'm tempted to look at my tranny and see if it has the bolt holes for the dual mounts.

Just for info, the 84 Auto's used the exact same mounts as any manual Fiero, they also used the cheaper engine mounts. I changed all 3 engine mounts in my Fiero for $89 CDN. So about $50 American back then.

I was curious and asked how much a front engine mount is for my Quad 4 (they use 2 engine mounts and no dogbone), and a solid rubber one is $160.00, and an OEM style gel filled one is $215.00!!!

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84 Fiero Sport Coupe #1192 :: 86 Fiero Base Coupe :: 84 Chevette CS 4 DoorDetails on my Fiero hereMember of the Edmonto Fiero Club

Wow, that sucks about the Quad 4 mounts...

I'm about to go outside and try to test fit a 85GT front engine mount (the cheap/solid one) in place of my beat down OEM one. I'll report back with what I find in a couple hours...

I've never had any trouble with the mounts on Janes 84 auto, other than they were oil soaked when we 1st bought it. Changed them back in 99 I believe and it's been pretty solid ever since. I don't remember how much they were, but they couldn't have been too much or I wouldn't have been able to change them all at one time.

The car is an 85. The engine is an 84 block, converted to the 85+ electronics. The U bracket that was on the 85 was in 3 pieces (from the crappy mounts, and dumb PO), so I grabbed one from my parts shed. The U bracket bolted to the 84 block, and the 86 V6 front mount bolted to that. The mount then fit on the 85 cradle. Again, I don't know the year of the tranny, but it had that center mount thing. The center mount was removed, and the two side mounts were added. This was then bolted to the cradle with no problem.

Now that I write this, I'm unsure if the cradle was from an auto car. Thinking back, the original cradle had that 'flange' that sticks off the driver side inner part of the cradle. This cradle it was mounted on did not have that flange, just the holes for the two side mounts. It doesn't look like the auto would hit that flange if it was there, but I'm almost positive the man trans would hit that center flange.

Unfortunatly, I don't have a car that I can just go take apart, so I had to do it with stuff from the shed. Hopefully this will still help out somewhat.

Well, I tried to put an 85V6 front engine mount in place of the 86' 4 Cylinder front engine mount - No go.

The bolt spacing on the 86 motor bracket is identical, and can accept either mount. However the cradle side bracket bolt hole spacing is different. The studs on the two mounts are also in different places as well, in two axes (x and y, not just spacing apart, if that makes sense). As a final problem, the height of the 86' fluid filled mount is more than the height of the 85'V6 mount.

So that isn't going to work any time soon. So does anyone have part numbers/links to an 86-87 4Cyl/88V6 front engine mount aside from the Fiero Store? Somebody mentioned a solid rubber mount - which would be to my preference - do they make solid rubber replacements? I don't want another liquid filled mount, if I can help it. Thanks you guys.

OK, I did some research for you today.
The Ankor mount 2472 will work on either end. I have a fluid mount in the garage and compared it to the other, which I also had and the height and bolt spacing are the same.
I also looked in the ankor book for the 2783 mount which looks similar but I suspect the bolt spacing is different.

Hope this helps you out.

Indiana - Definite + for you, if you haven't received one already.

I took some pics to share with you guys. Here's my dillemma:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/pyromaniacal/Engine%20Mounts/Wrecked.jpg
Notice the caked on oil and leaking fluid. I think that answers the question about 86-87 4 cylinder auto engine mounts being fluid filled... There's literally some sorta oil inside a rubber envelope. The thing is about the size of a brick too. Pretty hammered eh?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/pyromaniacal/Engine%20Mounts/Engine_Side.jpg
85V6 front engine mounts on the left, 86 4 Cylinder motor mount on the right. The studs which bolt into the engine bracket are facing eachother, and the spacing is interchangeable.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v249/pyromaniacal/Engine%20Mounts/Cradle_Side.jpg
86' 4banger Front engine mount on the left (obviously), and 85V6 on the right. Cradle side facing up. The studs aren't even close when it comes to position and pattern. Also the 86' 4banger mount is much taller than the 85V6. Gotta love the oil and fluid leaking everywhere - nasty.

Here's Indiana's part number: http://www.partsamerica.com/PartDetails.asp?SourceArea=&SourcePage=SEARCHRESULTS&MfrCode=ANH&MfrPartNumber=2472

Man, 15 bucks? NOW we're talking... You can look up the other part number we saw, but I don't think it's relevant at this point. Indiana, I have one last question for you (thank you for your help, btw) - part number 2472, is there a way to find out if it's the same as the 85'V6 mount I tried out? If so, it's not going to space out correctly for stud pattern, width and height. If it isn't and *is* a replacement for my fluid filled mount... then you kick some serious ass!

That toasted motor mount looks really familiar.

That Anchor mount looks really familiar, too. I can't tell from the photo if the bolt spacing is correct, though.

The book called for 84 & 85 4 cylinder (substitute) and 85 thru 87 V-6 as part # 2472 front mount.
Cross checked it three times, same applications. 2712 is the hyduraulic mount I think (from memory).
I couldn't tell much about the 2783 as it was a side view but I think I ordered one before and determined that it wouldn't work.

Keep in mind it only goes in one way due to the offset in the bolt pattern.

[This message has been edited by Indiana_resto_guy (edited 02-17-2005).]

Ok, I had some time to sit on here and do some research -

http://webepc.com/cgi-bin/sewse?/home/httpd/cmm/scripts/epc10.cmm+anchor Anchor's catalog. I looked for engine mounts for an 86 Fiero 2.5 Auto, and they said they didn't have them. Same for 87. Out of curiosity, I looked for an engine mount for a 85' V6 - and it came up with Anchor # 2472 - which doesn't line up correctly as I just tested. Damn! So part # 2472 won't work.

Then I did a search for a 1988 Fiero V6, and to my surprise it came up with Anchor part # 2548 - [Engine Mount] Frt RH; hydraulic. http://www.partsamerica.com/PartDetails.asp?SourceArea=&SourcePage=SEARCHRESULTS&MfrCode=ANH&MfrPartNumber=2548

Best of all? It costs 45 bucks from Kragen, and it's in stock at my local store! YES! YES! YES! WOO-HAH!

The Fiero Store says: FRONT ENGINE MOUNT The Fiero Store carries replacement rubber mounts that meet or exceed OEM specifications Fits: 86-87 4cyl automatic, 88 V-6 Part # 52901 | $139.95

As a side note, I still can't find the transmission mount...

Update: I've installed the replacement front engine mount (liquid filled, but was inexpenensive), rebushed the dogbone with poly, and left the tranny mount alone (it was alright). I have pictures of it all if anyone wants to see. The car vibrates like a Harley still. I know the 4 Cylinder motor inherently has secondary shaking forces, while our 60 degree V6 is perfectly mechanically balanced. I also know the 2.5 is not equipped with a balance shaft either.

I wonder if anyone has managed to get satisfactory use out of a poly dogbone on a duke without excess vibration? Wonder if the manual tranny mounts (dual mounts, front and back) will greatly help take up the slack and ease up force applied to the dogbone?

The trick is to only replace one of the dogbone bushings with urethane, with a rubber bushing in the other end. That should bring the chassis vibration down to tolerable levels. And it'll still reduce the engine wiggle.

Yeah, I've been driving the car around alot - the vibration in gear at a stoplight is just killing me. I mean, I'm alright with some vibration, but on the 86' 2 mount system the car shakes so bad that it's vibrating my rearview mirrors and rattling interior trim off! It's pretty rough... I'm thinking about going back to a new rubber bone.

BTW - on the mechanically balanced 60*V6, the poly bushings in the dogbone don't even make a real difference vibration wise, but shifts and decel are nice and firm and there's no engine slop. I love it. I think I might steal the long dogbone that I refitted with poly from my 2.5 car for my 3.4L DOHC project, and replace it with a stock rubber bone.

Ok, what is the low cost replacement for 88 front engine mount, 4 cyl? Fiero Store shows two different part numbers from 87-88. 52901 and 52902. Are they truely different? What is the low cost replacement? $140 for a new mount seems a little extreme

J.