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Properly sized turbocharger? by FastIndyFiero
Started on: 03-04-2004 05:16 PM
Replies: 23
Last post by: FastIndyFiero on 03-08-2004 05:59 PM
FastIndyFiero
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Report this Post03-04-2004 05:16 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FastIndyFieroClick Here to visit FastIndyFiero's HomePageClick Here to Email FastIndyFieroSend a Private Message to FastIndyFieroDirect Link to This Post
Well, I got a report back from the machine shop yesterday. My SD head that just got finished with a valve job and some port cleanup is going to cause some mighty low compression. The old head combustion chamber volume was 49cc's, this one's got 64 cc chambers. You do the math. Also, it looks like the new head will flow all the way up to .700" of valve lift, and I only have .500".

All of this adds up to being a ripe candidate for a turbocharger. I'm not particualarly knowlegable about turbo's. I'm sure I could install one when the time comes. But can anyone suggest a turbo size? From my research (which started this morning), it looks like the T3/T4 hybrid might be my best bet. I was looking at 210-220 HP before the turbo.

Anyone have any ideas? Is there anyplace where I can go on the net to find out more about turbo's? Like, everything?

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California Kid
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Report this Post03-04-2004 07:29 PM Click Here to See the Profile for California KidSend a Private Message to California KidDirect Link to This Post
I think the best solution to your problem is to decide which make turbo you want to go with, then contact them, they will have a technical department the can assist you after you feed them information on the engine, and car.
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hugh
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Report this Post03-04-2004 07:53 PM Click Here to See the Profile for hughClick Here to Email hughSend a Private Message to hughDirect Link to This Post
Innovative Turbo in California,talk to Rick Head.If he can't advise you,nobody can!
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fieroman87
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Report this Post03-04-2004 08:36 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fieroman87Click Here to Email fieroman87Send a Private Message to fieroman87Direct Link to This Post
what engine is it? I have the garrett catalog on my puter and can match you w/ the proper size.
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FastIndyFiero
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Report this Post03-04-2004 11:54 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FastIndyFieroClick Here to visit FastIndyFiero's HomePageClick Here to Email FastIndyFieroSend a Private Message to FastIndyFieroDirect Link to This Post
It's an Iron Duke...
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fieroman87
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Report this Post03-05-2004 12:18 AM Click Here to See the Profile for fieroman87Click Here to Email fieroman87Send a Private Message to fieroman87Direct Link to This Post
find a T25 (ball bearing type) or T28 out of a WRX (98 and up) also w/ the ball bearing center housing. either of those will work wonders for your duke and will give you instant low end.

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FastIndyFiero
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Report this Post03-05-2004 05:42 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FastIndyFieroClick Here to visit FastIndyFiero's HomePageClick Here to Email FastIndyFieroSend a Private Message to FastIndyFieroDirect Link to This Post
Bump for anyone with input...
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fieroturbo
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Report this Post03-05-2004 11:26 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fieroturboClick Here to Email fieroturboSend a Private Message to fieroturboDirect Link to This Post
If it's a duke, I hope you built up the bottom end. No way can stock bottom end dukes hold up to more than 200HP. 180HP is pushing it for 88's, and a nono for earlier years.

For a 2.5L, yeah, a T3/T4 Hybrid would be a great choice. Go to www.exploitedracing.com for decently priced turbos. It's where I got mine.

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FastIndyFiero
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Report this Post03-06-2004 03:45 AM Click Here to See the Profile for FastIndyFieroClick Here to visit FastIndyFiero's HomePageClick Here to Email FastIndyFieroSend a Private Message to FastIndyFieroDirect Link to This Post
One more thing, would -6AN hose be an adequate size for an oil return line?
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fieroturbo
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Report this Post03-06-2004 10:05 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fieroturboClick Here to Email fieroturboSend a Private Message to fieroturboDirect Link to This Post
For a T3/T4, it should be. I'll consult my references just to be sure.
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Report this Post03-07-2004 02:21 AM Click Here to See the Profile for fieroman87Click Here to Email fieroman87Send a Private Message to fieroman87Direct Link to This Post
why are you insistant on the T3/T4 hybrid? that's too big for a daily driver that only needs to make 200 hp, Plus they're more expensive than a good used turbo from a WRX which BTW has a 2.5L engine and at low boost doesn't require an IC.

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FastIndyFiero
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Report this Post03-07-2004 03:07 AM Click Here to See the Profile for FastIndyFieroClick Here to visit FastIndyFiero's HomePageClick Here to Email FastIndyFieroSend a Private Message to FastIndyFieroDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by fieroman87:

why are you insistant on the T3/T4 hybrid? that's too big for a daily driver that only needs to make 200 hp, Plus they're more expensive than a good used turbo from a WRX which BTW has a 2.5L engine and at low boost doesn't require an IC.

I wouldn't say that I'm insistent on the T3/T4. But I was planning on making 200-210 Hp before the turbo. Anyway, I'll call some manufacturers and find out what I need.

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dbtk2
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Report this Post03-07-2004 12:54 PM Click Here to See the Profile for dbtk2Click Here to Email dbtk2Send a Private Message to dbtk2Direct Link to This Post
The T25 on my 3.1 GP's would work great in your situation. They spool up instantly because they are so small, and yet they are still big enough to produce decent boost, even though they aren't the ball bearing type. The ball bearing type would be even better! IIRC the optimum engine size for it is like 2.4L, so that makes it just about perfect for your application. They can easily produce 250hp on an engine, and with an intercooler and the right setup you should be able to see 280hp or so, which should be PLENTY for your application. You can usually find them pretty cheap on ebay too.

Thats always an option.

Shawn

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Report this Post03-07-2004 12:57 PM Click Here to See the Profile for donk316Click Here to Email donk316Send a Private Message to donk316Direct Link to This Post
Ive got a rhb6 ball bearing turbo that would be ideal for your setup. Super fast spooling and a quality unit.

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Report this Post03-07-2004 04:46 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fieroturboClick Here to Email fieroturboSend a Private Message to fieroturboDirect Link to This Post
T3 Super 60's are great too. Very responsive, and little or no boost lag. Easy to get parts for too. Exploited has those as well. But if you're trying to have 200-210 before the boost, then T3/T4 is better. The motor will be able to spool that up with no problem.

The T3/T4 isn't a bad choice either way, unless we're talking a bone stock duke, which we're not. The T3/T4 is a good choice for little lag, with high boost potential (over 15psi). It's the stepping stone between the T3 Super 60, and the T60-1


BTW, the word on the T3/T4 oil fittings is this, for the 6AN fitting:

Quoted from Brian at Exploited Racing:
"I say its to big for oil feed, to small for oil return, tell him to use -4AN for the feed. and 5/8" hose for return."

He makes turbo kits....complete kits. He sells individual turbo's as well. I'd bet big bucks on his knowledge. He's knows his stuff. Incredible welder too! I have a log-style stainless steel turbo manifold that he made, and it is flawless.

If you need more help, lemme know. I have knowledge of my own about turbo stuff, plus dozens of other peeps that know even more.

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1988 Pontiac Fiero 2.5L, soon to be 2.2L Ecotec Turbo (THE PROJECT HAS STARTED!!!)
1988 Oldsmobile Firenza 2.0L non-turbo (R.I.P.my beloved J-body. KIA by a Ford)
1994 Chevy S-10 4.3, it's finally here, and it is gorgeous!

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bryson
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Report this Post03-07-2004 09:48 PM Click Here to See the Profile for brysonSend a Private Message to brysonDirect Link to This Post
When we turbocharged my friends 2.0L Jetta we used a T3 Super 60 -- even on a 2.0 it begins to make boost around 2000 rpm. For a 2.5 that can flow as well as the SD, I would probably go with a smaller T3/T04E. If you can afford it, go with a ball-bearing unit! One thing though -- not all are the same! I've spun a Garrett ball bearing and a Turbonetics ball bearing and there is NO comparison! The Garrett is amazing! If you have the funds, take a look at the GT30R or the GT35R. When I upgrade, I will probably go with the GT35R because with my 2.3 it should spool even earlier than the turbo I have now.
As far as the oil lines go, I think Michael is right. I used -4 AN for the feed and -10 AN for the return, along with -6 coolant lines. Good luck!
--Bryson

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Report this Post03-07-2004 10:02 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Howard_SacksClick Here to visit Howard_Sacks's HomePageClick Here to Email Howard_SacksSend a Private Message to Howard_SacksDirect Link to This Post
GT35R gets a thumbs up from me if you've got the bling. SC61 if you're on a budget. You can make 500 horse with the SC61 if your bottom end can take it.

 
quote
Originally posted by bryson:
I've spun a Garrett ball bearing and a Turbonetics ball bearing and there is NO comparison! The Garrett is amazing! If you have the funds, take a look at the GT30R or the GT35R.

FastIndy, you posted that you have an SD head, but what kind of block are you running? If you've got a duke block, I'd take a step back and either get a SD one or something.

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Report this Post03-07-2004 10:04 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Howard_SacksClick Here to visit Howard_Sacks's HomePageClick Here to Email Howard_SacksSend a Private Message to Howard_SacksDirect Link to This Post

Howard_Sacks

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Keep in mind, not all T3/T4 hybrids are created equal.

 
quote
Originally posted by fieroturbo:

T3 Super 60's are great too. Very responsive, and little or no boost lag. Easy to get parts for too. Exploited has those as well. But if you're trying to have 200-210 before the boost, then T3/T4 is better. The motor will be able to spool that up with no problem.

The T3/T4 isn't a bad choice either way, unless we're talking a bone stock duke, which we're not. The T3/T4 is a good choice for little lag, with high boost potential (over 15psi). It's the stepping stone between the T3 Super 60, and the T60-1


BTW, the word on the T3/T4 oil fittings is this, for the 6AN fitting:

Quoted from Brian at Exploited Racing:
"I say its to big for oil feed, to small for oil return, tell him to use -4AN for the feed. and 5/8" hose for return."

He makes turbo kits....complete kits. He sells individual turbo's as well. I'd bet big bucks on his knowledge. He's knows his stuff. Incredible welder too! I have a log-style stainless steel turbo manifold that he made, and it is flawless.

If you need more help, lemme know. I have knowledge of my own about turbo stuff, plus dozens of other peeps that know even more.

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Report this Post03-07-2004 10:20 PM Click Here to See the Profile for GTDudeClick Here to Email GTDudeDirect Link to This Post
Hmmmmmmmm.........putting a turbo on a duke. Kansas is a bit too far for me so be sure to give your cellphone # to lots of friends and keep track of their schedules. It'll make it alot easier on you when it flies all to sh!t one night when you stomp it............LOL.

But seriously, please dos some beefing up of the lower end if you're gonna run a turbo. The duke just wasn't made for that kind of torque. Good luck.

Phil

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Report this Post03-07-2004 10:21 PM Click Here to See the Profile for GTDudeClick Here to Email GTDudeDirect Link to This Post

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Report this Post03-07-2004 10:22 PM Click Here to See the Profile for GTDudeClick Here to Email GTDudeDirect Link to This Post

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Report this Post03-07-2004 10:24 PM Click Here to See the Profile for GTDudeClick Here to Email GTDudeDirect Link to This Post

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FastIndyFiero
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Report this Post03-08-2004 12:12 AM Click Here to See the Profile for FastIndyFieroClick Here to visit FastIndyFiero's HomePageClick Here to Email FastIndyFieroSend a Private Message to FastIndyFieroDirect Link to This Post
Wow, thanks everyone for the input. Trust me, I know about the weak Duke bottom end.

While it won't be able to handle 500 ponies quite yet, the bottom end I'll build will be sufficient for a conservative amount of boost. I'm not doing anything real crazy yet, and I need to be able to run pump gas, so nothing terribly drastic is happening. Anyway, at the least, I'll use the S10 truck block.

Something that is valuable to me is the ability for higher RPM whenever a better rotating assembly is available to me. While it's not important to me now for the turbo to make good power at 7000 rpm, it would be nice to not have to get a differently sized turbo, if my engine is ever capable of pulling those numbers. Am I asking too much? I know everything is a compromise...

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FastIndyFiero
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Report this Post03-08-2004 05:59 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FastIndyFieroClick Here to visit FastIndyFiero's HomePageClick Here to Email FastIndyFieroSend a Private Message to FastIndyFieroDirect Link to This Post
One more bump...
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