i have my aarms off the car and all the bolts, nuts and washers ina bag, apparently though, there is a definite trick to how and where the various washers and shims are reinstalled back on the upper aarm, I neglected to record the order in which they were removed, can anyone walk me through the proper reistallation and process for proper alignment

I think the washers are used to set caster. Just try to even them out and take the car for an alignment, you will need one anyway, and they will put them on right.

There are three size washers 3mm, 6mm and 9mm. You must use 12mm total on each side so you use either 2-6mm's or 3mm+9mm. You want the arms as far back as possible (max caster). If you have a pair of 6mm washers in there now, it's easy: 1-6mm in the front and 1-6mm in the back. If you have the 3+9mm pair then put the 3mm in front and the 9 in back. Unless something is bent, use the same sets on the left and right.

You can't put a 3+6 or 9+6 on there because it's either below 12mm or above. You need 12mm total.

Since the Fiero is always short on caster, you want the upper arms as far back as possible to maximize caster. If you use 12mm worth on each side and install them to move the upper arms as far back as possible, you will be fine.

Id just install the 12 mm worth of shims required and take it to an alignment shop. There going to have to take readings to reinstall them anyway. Chances are both sides are not going to be the same. Just be sure you tell them you didnt put them in correctly and to torque the bolts when there done. Most alignment shops dont mess with them unless you tell them. Theyll just say they got it as close as they could. There is no reason to have your car pull one way or the other after its alighned if they do it correctly.

Other than using some odd-ball non-GM washers, there are only two settings. 6+6 and 9+3. I guess you could put both 6's or the 3 and 9 on the same end that would give you more/or less caster. I haven't seen a pre-88 that needed different pairs on the left and right. I'd be curious if anyone else has. Roger, do you see that very often?

From the factory they were marginal on caster as it was, so invariably the caster has to be increased and that's why the 9+3 kit exists (a few other cars use the same kit. Chevette is one).

I'm curious if any had 3+9mm washers from the factory.

Either way, when ever I rebuild a front end I get the 3+9 kit and run the top arms back. The caster is always in spec and falls between 5-7 degrees. If not, something is usually bent. Not that I've done very many mind you. 5-6 there-bouts.

In the end, only an alignment will tell.

On a nearly 20 year old car, chances are very high that maybe the frame isnt exactly square or one of the A-arms is slightly bent. Dont take much of a bump to go out a few millimeters. I know one of mine was off from right to left. I didnt do any suspension work, and didnt see any sign of damage. Mine pulled to left on a level, straight road all the time.

Hello TK, very impressed with your answer I agree that all fieros need as much caster as possible. And Rodger you are right most shops dont want to do the caster just the toe. You guys have a good night. Norm www.normsfiberglass.com

quote Originally posted by normsf: Hello TK, very impressed with your answer I agree that all fieros need as much caster as possible. And Rodger you are right most shops dont want to do the caster just the toe. You guys have a good night. Norm www.normsfiberglass.com

The pisser is that it's so easy to swap the washers. I had one shop tell me it took an hour to do it. I showed the mechanic how to do both sides in under 5 minutes. Amazing what you can do with a jack and 10/18mm wrenches. The worst part is droping the washers on the floor 5 times.

I agree Roger, if the front end is wacked out (bend or saggingfrom age) it might take odd pairs between the sides. If I can get with 2 degrees caster between the sides, I'm happy.

I am still curious is anyone has 9+3 from the factory. That would tell us how much production variation there was.

[This message has been edited by TK (edited 12-18-2003).]