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Rotary? by rctruck01
Started on: 09-21-2003 01:36 AM
Replies: 53
Last post by: Michelhaugh on 09-30-2003 08:04 AM
rctruck01
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Report this Post09-21-2003 01:36 AM Click Here to See the Profile for rctruck01Send a Private Message to rctruck01Direct Link to This Post
I was just wondering if anyone knew of somebody that put a rotary motor in a Fiero. I have a 430hp Tri rotor tri turbo rotary that I'm going to put in and I just want an example.
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Report this Post09-21-2003 01:44 AM Click Here to See the Profile for GTDudeDirect Link to This Post
WOW !!!!!!!!!! I don't know a thing about them, but sounds like a GREAT engine swap. Keep us up to date on it.

Phil

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Report this Post09-21-2003 02:13 AM Click Here to See the Profile for SplineZClick Here to visit SplineZ's HomePageSend a Private Message to SplineZDirect Link to This Post
20b tri rotor! this would rock seriously, and I would LOVE to see it.. from a cosmo i assume?

keep us up to date!

James Z

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edhering
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Report this Post09-21-2003 02:33 AM Click Here to See the Profile for edheringClick Here to visit edhering's HomePageSend a Private Message to edheringDirect Link to This Post
Wait wait wait, backup, wait a second.

#1: "Cosmo"? WTF is a "Cosmo"?
#2: 430 HP??

I'm interested in knowing more. I do recall seeing a web site http://www.freedom-motors.com/

in which they discussed (some time ago) generatiing about 250 hp from a 3-rotor engine. Of course, they have since updated their site, and now are talking about replacement motors for personal watercraft and such...

Interesting.

Ed

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Report this Post09-21-2003 06:29 AM Click Here to See the Profile for CaddyRobClick Here to visit CaddyRob's HomePageSend a Private Message to CaddyRobDirect Link to This Post
I believe this has been discussed, but it was thought that there would be a heat problem due to the small engine compartment that has inadiquate air flow. I would assume you would be using a Mazda Rx-7 engine, out of the 3rd Gen car. It would be a very interesting swap! Good luck.

Later;

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warden
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Report this Post09-21-2003 07:33 AM Click Here to See the Profile for wardenClick Here to visit warden's HomePageSend a Private Message to wardenDirect Link to This Post
im sorry dont take this offensively.. but swaping a triangle motor is a waste of time and money.. because you will get one good run with the motor and it will blow a seal. everytime i am at the track i at least see 30% of the tri's run and break..

in theroy its a great motor but like all theroys they have to face reality...

you cant seal something triangle with a circle.

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Report this Post09-21-2003 10:18 AM Click Here to See the Profile for JefrysukoSend a Private Message to JefrysukoDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by warden:
you cant seal something triangle with a circle.

It's an OVAL first of all, and if it is so impossible then why is Mazda making more cars with Rotary engines and willing to waranty them?

I don't know of anyone who has done a Rotary swap yet but a friend of mine has looked into it. The main problem we came across was that the exhaust would come out directly into the passenger side axle. I would like to know if you have come up with a solution for this yet.

[This message has been edited by Jefrysuko (edited 09-21-2003).]

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Report this Post09-21-2003 11:06 AM Click Here to See the Profile for L44_87GTSend a Private Message to L44_87GTDirect Link to This Post
Rotarys are horrible.There are plenty of more reliable better swaps that can put out those numbers without the hassle of a installing a forien engine into an american car.There are tons of pipe dreamers on the forum that say they are putting these types of motors in and never do.

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Will
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Report this Post09-21-2003 11:28 AM Click Here to See the Profile for WillSend a Private Message to WillDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by rctruck01:

I was just wondering if anyone knew of somebody that put a rotary motor in a Fiero. I have a 430hp Tri rotor tri turbo rotary that I'm going to put in and I just want an example.

I don't think it's been done, although it has been discussed several times.

There's a guy on the forum named FieroX who has a saying that might apply here: "F@#$ the naysayers 'cause they don't mean a dam' thing"

Guys, anyone who already has a 20b knows a bit about the care and feeding of turbo rotaries.

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warden
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Report this Post09-21-2003 12:08 PM Click Here to See the Profile for wardenClick Here to visit warden's HomePageSend a Private Message to wardenDirect Link to This Post
mazda is bringing it out again for one reason only.. the little miata frenzy has ended and their market will plumet inless they put something new out there.. they are just following the trends.. it was the only sports car they had.. the 350z came out.. the gto is coming out..

the new ford mustang will have the old 60s look.

All these companies are bringing back the old cars and they feel left out.

if they dont back their car with a warranty noone will buy it.. and its in the forgiving eye so to speak.. "ohh its been how many years.. most of the kinks had to be worked out.." and thats the average customers attitude..

(please people had pet rocks) you can sell anything

my point was before this and this only..

to much fabrication for a motor that has the reliability of a paper hanglider.

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Report this Post09-21-2003 12:33 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JazzManSend a Private Message to JazzManDirect Link to This Post
So I guess you guys missed the 4-rotor Corvette prototype from the early 70's? http://www.monito.com/wankel/corvette.html and http://www.corvette.nl/specials/xp882.html and lots more if you search for Corvette and Rotary.

I happen to like rotaries from an engineering point of view. They have the highest power output potential per unit of engine weight of any non 2-stroke engines. Because they don't have reciprocating parts the only thing limiting RPM and thus power output is rotor tip seal wear, and that's just an engineering materials problem. The more air you can get into one and the faster you spin it, the more power you get, not unlike a jet engine.

JazzMan

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Report this Post09-21-2003 01:27 PM Click Here to See the Profile for rctruck01Send a Private Message to rctruck01Direct Link to This Post
I work at a shop and the guy that I was building it for was going to put it in his boat. But the he got his hands on a Quad rotor with like 800hp on the bottle. He said it will make around 700 or 650 without the NOS. So I bought the motor from him and thought it would be interesting to put a rotary in a Fiero. I think I have the cooling problem sovved. I will mount a small radiator in the back too with a fan on it and plumb it in so when the coolent goes to the ront and back before it goes back to the motor it will be cooled again. With that in place I don't think I will have a ny problems. My worst problem right now is if the transmission will hook up or if I will have to buy a Mazda transmission. I will also custom make my own exhaust system so it will work. I plan to machine my own motor mounts too. I don't have any pics yet but once I get some I will post them.
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Report this Post09-21-2003 01:43 PM Click Here to See the Profile for WillSend a Private Message to WillDirect Link to This Post
Mazda never used a transverse FWD rotary, did they? You'll have to use someone's FWD trans, as no rotary trans will work.
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virii01
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Report this Post09-21-2003 02:22 PM Click Here to See the Profile for virii01Send a Private Message to virii01Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by rctruck01:

I work at a shop and the guy that I was building it for was going to put it in his boat. But the he got his hands on a Quad rotor with like 800hp on the bottle. He said it will make around 700 or 650 without the NOS.

Ok, not to be rude, but until I see pics, I'm calling BS on the four rotor. Was this a custom fab 4 rotor or did you happen to find a wrecked 787 in a junk yard?

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Report this Post09-21-2003 02:23 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TryxalonClick Here to visit Tryxalon's HomePageSend a Private Message to TryxalonDirect Link to This Post
I'm an old RX-7 guy having owned 4 of them. One of them had over 270,000 miles on the engine before it died.

Main problem? It was a Unibody and Michigan salt and snow destroys the body. of the four, only one had an engine that "wore out". They are easy to rebuild (apex and side seals) and normally do get over 100,000 miles on even a rebuild.

The engine? The Wankel is a fantastic engine -- within it's parameters. The stock 12a's and 13b's with 200+Hp and smooth rotary torque in 70 cubic inches (1.2 to 1.3 liters) make it fantastic. Equal power output to piston engines that are 3 times thier size. BUT they are a 'horsepower' engine and lack torque -- a serious problem in any application but a) normal driving or b) rally racing. They suck in drag racing.

As far as fitting the transmission ... SBC V-8's don't bolt up to Fiero transmissions either!! And some people DO put SBC in RX-7 vehicles with the Mazda transmission. (check the Rex message boards).


The new Reginesis version of the Wankel used in the Rx-8 is a very advanced modern engine. I think it would be an excellent "swap candidate" and would be very unique. But there is as much "engineering" to get that working as Archie's first V-8 Fiero ... or the first Northstar ... or any other swap.

of course ... I'm one to talk!
I'm the one staying with the Iron Duke!!

[This message has been edited by Tryxalon (edited 09-21-2003).]

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rctruck01
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Report this Post09-21-2003 02:25 PM Click Here to See the Profile for rctruck01Send a Private Message to rctruck01Direct Link to This Post
Well not to be rude but that was a really stupid question. This was a completely custom motor. It is around 20g to build. The 787 also produced close to 1000hp not 650 or 700.
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Report this Post09-21-2003 02:50 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mattmSend a Private Message to mattmDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by warden:

mazda is bringing it out again for one reason only.. the little miata frenzy has ended and their market will plumet inless they put something new out there.. they are just following the trends.. it was the only sports car they had.. the 350z came out.. the gto is coming out..
When the hell is the new Fiero coming out!

the new ford mustang will have the old 60s look.

All these companies are bringing back the old cars and they feel left out.

if they dont back their car with a warranty noone will buy it.. and its in the forgiving eye so to speak.. "ohh its been how many years.. most of the kinks had to be worked out.." and thats the average customers attitude..

(please people had pet rocks) you can sell anything

my point was before this and this only..

to much fabrication for a motor that has the reliability of a paper hanglider.

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Report this Post09-21-2003 02:50 PM Click Here to See the Profile for virii01Send a Private Message to virii01Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by rctruck01:
The 787 also produced close to 1000hp not 650 or 700.

Actually, it did put out around 700hp. http://www.fast-autos.net/mazda/mazda787b.html http://homepage.ntlworld.com/harvey.towers/mazda.html http://www.mazdafun.com/rx7%20engine.htm

And forgive me for being skeptical, but it is hard enough finding a 20b-rew in America let alone a 26b. Believe me, we tried. We eventually found a used 20b-rew and it was very expensive. Who did the four-rotor?

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Report this Post09-21-2003 02:51 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mattmSend a Private Message to mattmDirect Link to This Post
When is the new Fiero coming out!! (i wish)
 
quote
Originally posted by warden:

mazda is bringing it out again for one reason only.. the little miata frenzy has ended and their market will plumet inless they put something new out there.. they are just following the trends.. it was the only sports car they had.. the 350z came out.. the gto is coming out..

the new ford mustang will have the old 60s look.

All these companies are bringing back the old cars and they feel left out.

if they dont back their car with a warranty noone will buy it.. and its in the forgiving eye so to speak.. "ohh its been how many years.. most of the kinks had to be worked out.." and thats the average customers attitude..

(please people had pet rocks) you can sell anything

my point was before this and this only..

to much fabrication for a motor that has the reliability of a paper hanglider.

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Report this Post09-21-2003 03:04 PM Click Here to See the Profile for silver86seSend a Private Message to silver86seDirect Link to This Post
hi the idea is very intriguing, a friend stuck a 12b in a susuki samuri and does hardcore four wheeling, very powerful for such a small engine, having driven a first gen rx7 lots of pep and very high rev limit

i think you could probably do it but i see that cooling and trans matchup or fabrication of adapter plate and mounting would be very difficult engineering problem

if you really want try this then don't give up
good luck..........

ps seems the sametings were said if, or about the fiero in the beginning, there lots of rx7's all gens running around, many are very reliable

[This message has been edited by silver86se (edited 09-21-2003).]

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Report this Post09-21-2003 03:09 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 87gt5speedSend a Private Message to 87gt5speedDirect Link to This Post
What are the odds...........my friend is obsessed with the idea of a 20B fiero! We were just talking about it! Small world!
Personally, I cant hate the idea, because id love to shove a SBC into an RX-7...so to each his own!

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Report this Post09-21-2003 03:15 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JefrysukoSend a Private Message to JefrysukoDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by rctruck01:
I will also custom make my own exhaust system so it will work.

You never really answered my question but maybe I need to explain myself a little better.

I am assuming that you will use a transaxle like the Fiero used or most any FWD vehicle. I saw a 12A placed next to a Fiero transaxle and the exhaust output on the motor was only a couple inches from the passenger side axle. Even with a custom exhaust we couldn't see how a tight enough bend could be made. If when you do get to the point of looking into the exhaust I would appreciate you letting us know what you have come up with. We have come up with a possible solution but havn't looked into it fully.

As for the Transmission I am going to have to agree with WILL. I don't believe there is a Transaxle that will bolt up to the Rotary. I would bet that an adapter plate would be the best option just like the V8 swaps. The adapter plate might be a blessing anyways as the Rotary motors use a rather thick clutch/flywheel design.

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Report this Post09-22-2003 01:01 AM Click Here to See the Profile for WillSend a Private Message to WillDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by virii01:
Actually, it did put out around 700hp.

Was also breathing through restrictors

 
quote
And forgive me for being skeptical, but it is hard enough finding a 20b-rew in America let alone a 26b. Believe me, we tried. We eventually found a used 20b-rew and it was very expensive. Who did the four-rotor?

Just like anything else, the good stuff is in Japan. I've seen the buildup of a 4 rotor documented on the internet. For ease of engine control and eccentric shaft machining, they put the two 13b elements "in phase". This made the engine somewhat less smooth than a proper 4 rotor, but much easier to run and tune. Heck, I've seen pictures of a 6 rotor.
The custom eccentric shaft is comparable to a billet crankshaft for a piston engine.

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Report this Post09-22-2003 01:51 AM Click Here to See the Profile for virii01Send a Private Message to virii01Direct Link to This Post
If anyone wants pictures, I have a few good ones of the 26b and one of a 6 rotor.
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Report this Post09-22-2003 01:58 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Scott-WaClick Here to visit Scott-Wa's HomePageSend a Private Message to Scott-WaDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by warden:

im sorry dont take this offensively.. but swaping a triangle motor is a waste of time and money.. because you will get one good run with the motor and it will blow a seal. everytime i am at the track i at least see 30% of the tri's run and break..

in theroy its a great motor but like all theroys they have to face reality...

you cant seal something triangle with a circle.


Warden, this was a bit ignorant. If they are blowing a rotary they would be grenading whatever they ran. Rotaries don't throw rods, suck pistons, flatten cam lobes, break springs, cranks etc.. they don't have them. They are amazingly reliable if treated right and in race form are close to grenade proof if built right. They don't ping, detonate, suffer from precombustion... just can't really happen due to design, they'd make good hydrogen engines for that reason.

Unlike a piston engine... on a Rotary, bigger carb, bigger intake ports, louder exhaust means faster... damn near impossible to open up flow to far... to over size exhaust, to over carb.

Problems? COLD start issues and driveability. That and they are damn near impossible for an average person to successfully rebuild due to sealing issues. But the rotary guys have answers for those issues.

Rotaries are compact and amazingly powerful for the size/weight... I say go for it.

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Report this Post09-22-2003 02:02 AM Click Here to See the Profile for virii01Send a Private Message to virii01Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Scott-Wa:
They don't ping, detonate, suffer from precombustion... just can't really happen due to design, they'd make good hydrogen engines for that reason.

That is incorrect. In fact, detonation is one of the major causes of engine failures in rotary motors. One good detonation can blow an apex seal.

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Report this Post09-22-2003 03:19 AM Click Here to See the Profile for SplineZClick Here to visit SplineZ's HomePageSend a Private Message to SplineZDirect Link to This Post
Mazda Cosmo.. only one of the slickest cars NOT to hit the us's streets Its kinda like a skinny caddy, plush inside, very slick outside... google it and see what you come up with

James Z

 
quote
Originally posted by edhering:

Wait wait wait, backup, wait a second.

#1: "Cosmo"? WTF is a "Cosmo"?
#2: 430 HP??

Ed

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Report this Post09-22-2003 06:31 AM Click Here to See the Profile for TennTSend a Private Message to TennTDirect Link to This Post
An article said the other day that the new rotaries had relocated exhaust ports. Best I remember the rotaries were a pretty dirty engine, smogwise. I think it was unburned hydrocarbons.
Why did Mazda stop production before?

Mercedes tried one in the late 60's/early 70's in a prototype called the C-111. I can't remember if it was a 3 or 4 rotor and I don't think it crossed the big pond, even if it ever made it into production (wasn't into Mercedes then, didn't think anything else about it).

TG

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Report this Post09-22-2003 07:27 AM Click Here to See the Profile for TryxalonClick Here to visit Tryxalon's HomePageSend a Private Message to TryxalonDirect Link to This Post
Mazda has not stopped production of the Rotary. Never did. 3 times as many are produced for light aircraft and boat engines (weight advantage) as ever have been produced for the cars.

The earlier Rotaries had a couple of problems:

A) General public compared them (economy wise) to engines of equal size. So they thought 20 miles per gallon for a 1.3 liter engine was abyssmal. But 20 MPG for a 200 horsepower engine is at least average. Like "Fiero's catch fire" "Rotaries guzzle gas".

B) Hydrocarbon emissions are not high -- NOX is. But the one thing that Catalytic converters are good at is NOX. But again perception was the problem.

C) Hard to find a regular mechanic to work on them -- and we know what dealerships charge!!

D) the Rx-7, like all sports cars (it's starting to happen to the Miata and that is why it is loosing sales)!! "evolved" from sports car to "grand Tourer" to "Personal Luxury" and yet another car priced itself out of its market. Same thing that happens with EVERY similar car: Opel GT, 240Z, Fiero, even the Corvette. Manufacturer tries to make one car for everyone.

Technically -- The adapter plate for the transmission is going to be a requirement. The Bigger Hurdle IS going to be the exhaust cause the rotary exhaust is very, very high temp.


Oh... uh "detonation" on a wankel?
Do you have a link or something? The reason I ask is none of the boys on the Rex forums have ever heard of detonation being a problem with the engine. We'd like to know.

Care to share??

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Report this Post09-22-2003 02:44 PM Click Here to See the Profile for davedClick Here to visit daved's HomePageSend a Private Message to davedDirect Link to This Post
I've owned an 86 RX7 GXL for 3 years, and yes, it has a blown apex seal at 230,000kM. It would live yet, but I over-reved it once, and at that milage....rebuild time, this winter.
I have a pic somewhere of a Delorean with a 20B in it. Although the Delorean is essentially a Volvo drive train, the 20B engine was succesfully transplanted, so it should give you an idea that it can be done to our Fieros. At what cost though, that should be the question. It certainly would be unique!
As for the exhaust difficulty. The exhaust ports come out of the right side of the rotor housings, and are collected in an ugly cast iron manifold. I judge that it would be easy to remove that manifold, and run separate exhaust headers from that point. With the engine mounted crosswise, the exhaust would be toward the firewall (facing toward the front of the car).

I belong to rx7club.com, and can tell you that many rotary types have posted regarding detonation destroying their engines. These are usually turbo, or modified engines. Thay do not act gracefully under pinging, and report just one severe detonation under boost will destroy the apex seals.

That said, the RX7 is still a wonderful machine that I feel compliments my "stable" along with my Fiero.
Dave

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Report this Post09-22-2003 03:22 PM Click Here to See the Profile for tony78taSend a Private Message to tony78taDirect Link to This Post
If all the naysayers here would look in the present instead of the past they would know that Mazda HAS worked out all the kinks with the rotary. (In the form of the RX-8)
Here's a quote from Mazda:
"The RENESIS (Rotary) engine, with 238 hp at 8,500 rpm and 159 lb-ft of torque at 5,500 rpm (6-speed manual transmission), is the highest output from a naturally aspirated, dual-rotor production engine. The RENESIS is the 2003 International Engine of the Year."

Also they're easier to work on than the "piston" engines because "less parts = less headaches"
Also it weighs close the half than any comparable powered engine.

Just my 2 pennies

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Report this Post09-22-2003 04:41 PM Click Here to See the Profile for virii01Send a Private Message to virii01Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Tryxalon:
Oh... uh "detonation" on a wankel?
Do you have a link or something? The reason I ask is none of the boys on the Rex forums have ever heard of detonation being a problem with the engine. We'd like to know.

Care to share??


-from above post

"I belong to rx7club.com, and can tell you that many rotary types have posted regarding detonation destroying their engines. These are usually turbo, or modified engines. Thay do not act gracefully under pinging, and report just one severe detonation under boost will destroy the apex seals."

That and a friend and I tore apart his 13b Turbo II which was blown. The cause? Detonation. It was running a Haltech E6K with aftermarket intake/exhaust/fuel delivery.
Want more references?

[This message has been edited by virii01 (edited 09-22-2003).]

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daved
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Report this Post09-22-2003 08:08 PM Click Here to See the Profile for davedClick Here to visit daved's HomePageSend a Private Message to davedDirect Link to This Post
I'm at home now and will attempt my first post of PIP. One of the Delorean 20B 3-rotor, and one showing the exhaust ports on a 13B....
Resized images; What a pain!
Well that was futile.
My password isnt working.
Try again later. Can someone tell me what I'm doing wrong?
Anyway, a free bump.
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TaurusThug
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Report this Post09-22-2003 08:54 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TaurusThugSend a Private Message to TaurusThugDirect Link to This Post
get a 13b and put a t51 turbo on it and also get a nice intake manifold and a nice tanabe racing medalion exaust and modifiy to your need
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Tryxalon
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Report this Post09-22-2003 09:21 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TryxalonClick Here to visit Tryxalon's HomePageSend a Private Message to TryxalonDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by virii01:

That and a friend and I tore apart his 13b Turbo II which was blown. The cause? Detonation. It was running a Haltech E6K with aftermarket intake/exhaust/fuel delivery.
Want more references?

Yes. Cause your analysis is suspect.
Can't happen. Why? Physics. The principles of the wankel cycle absolutely prevent it.

You may have had a seal failure, but a "detonation", as would happen in a piston engine would have to not only have to stop the rotation of the rotor, but after overcoming all that enertia would have to completely strip the planetary gears on the output shaft. That means the entire engine would have been destroyed. You would not have been able to 'disassemble' it.

Also, to 'detonate' and not be 'cleaned out' in the exhaust cycle (a requirement for 'blowing the seals') it also means that your 'detonation' would have to have produced sufficient force to so destroy the engine. The amount of gasoline vapor required to have such force even at 20:1 compression ratio (2x compression in a wankel) cannot fit in the rotor chamber of a 13b. It cannot fit (without going to liquid form and therefore impossible to ignite) within any volume less than approximately 2 cubic feet.

It is possible your friends engine was 'bad', or flawed. It is also true that one anecdote does not make a general statement true or false.

BUT, viewed from my knowledge of mechanics, physics and the Wankel engine, either your definition of "detonation" is vastly different from what I find in the dictionary or you are 'blowing smoke'.
"Ya cannot change the laws of physics."


HOWEVER, MY opinion of your view does not matter. You've made your point that you have no use for a rotary engine -- and that is your REAL point.

Very well, you are entitled to believe whatever you want.

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virii01
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Report this Post09-22-2003 10:53 PM Click Here to See the Profile for virii01Send a Private Message to virii01Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Tryxalon:

HOWEVER, MY opinion of your view does not matter. You've made your point that you have no use for a rotary engine -- and that is your REAL point.

Very well, you are entitled to believe whatever you want.

Yikes, talk about taking things out of context. I never said anything negative against the idea of putting or rotary in a Fiero, or against a wankel engine in general. I stated that from what I have heard from friends (rotary enthusiests) and read online, that the wankel engine can detonate. That does not mean I am against the engine. Try not to jump to conclusions so fast.

Anyway, back to the topic of detonation with a wankel engine, while it is possible I am wrong, here are a few more sources:

from http://www.atkinsrotary.com/engineQA.htm

 
quote
Should I use premium or regular gasoline?

For a turbo you should use 91 octane in order to avoid pinging/detonation/spark knock, etc. A good 87 octane that has a chemical additive for cleaner burning is fine for non-turbo.

from http://www.rx7.com/cgi-local/3catalog.cgi?cat=6&part=5

 
quote
Detonation is the #1 killer of high output turbocharged rotaries.

from http://www.mazdatrix.com/engines.htm

 
quote
They usually break the apex seals in the rear rotor (too much boost and/or detonation) which quite often destroys the center and rear side housings, as well as the rotor and rotor housing.

and finally:
from: http://www.teamfc3s.org/performance/ecuhints.htm

 
quote
What's Detonation? What does it sound like?

Detonation is a voilent explosion that can damage the engine severely. It also sounds and feels very much like Pre-ignition....

edited because I forgot a [ tag for a quote

[This message has been edited by virii01 (edited 09-22-2003).]

[This message has been edited by virii01 (edited 09-22-2003).]

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Jefrysuko
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Report this Post09-22-2003 10:54 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JefrysukoSend a Private Message to JefrysukoDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by daved:With the engine mounted crosswise, the exhaust would be toward the firewall (facing toward the front of the car).

Dave, I am sorry but I believe you are wrong about the exhaust location. I looked at a 12A. In a transverse configuration (crosswise) with the pulleys of the motor on the passenger side and the transmission on the driver side the exhaust will be facing towards the back of the car.

Please let me know if the exhaust port location of the rotary which you are refering to is different.

------------------

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Report this Post09-22-2003 11:05 PM Click Here to See the Profile for GridlockSend a Private Message to GridlockDirect Link to This Post
Just thought I'd throw out that Maxda has been accused of making up horsepower numbers on the RX-8.
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Report this Post09-23-2003 12:29 AM Click Here to See the Profile for edheringClick Here to visit edhering's HomePageSend a Private Message to edheringDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by SplineZ:

Mazda Cosmo.. only one of the slickest cars NOT to hit the us's streets Its kinda like a skinny caddy, plush inside, very slick outside... google it and see what you come up with

James Z

Ahh...I see. Do Japanese automakers give ANY of their domestic brands Japanese names? The only Japanese-named vehicle I can think of is the Samurai...and they named it that for the US market!

I can't think of a single Japanese car whose domestic (ie in-Japan) name is actually Japanese...

Not to hijack the thread or anything

Ed

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Report this Post09-23-2003 02:37 AM Click Here to See the Profile for PhaetonSend a Private Message to PhaetonDirect Link to This Post
I didn't use a dictionary, but want to throw 2 cents in.
After being lit the charge burns outward from the spark, pushing a pressure wave in front of itself, until all the charge is burnt and the pressure is pushing down the piston. When temps are high and the pressure is higher the point at which the charge ignites is reached by the pressure wave in front of the burn. This causes the rest of the charge to go off all at once, creating a detonation rather than a burn. The sooner after ignition this detonation happens the larger the explosion. Shape and inertia can determine how this shock is dissipated, but its formation is strictly a function of temp and pressure.
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