The White Bug
Topic started by: pmbrunelle, Date: 01-03-2019 10:14 AM
Original thread: http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/142133.html


pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #1, 01-03-2019 10:14 AM
      I purchased this Fiero in December 2016. A mostly bone-stock 1985 SE, with 53k miles.
Minimal rust and fairly decent paint; should look good enough (by my standard) with a wash and wax, and some minor fixes (dew wipes, headliner, that sort of thing).
It came with the automatic transmission, but that's fine; transmissions can be changed.

Half an hour into the 2 hour drive home, the 2.8 started knocking; the car had to be towed.

The engine's death signaled to me: PROJECT TIME!
Time to do the turbo project I've always wanted for a Fiero, get rid of the slushbox, and fix the "incidentals" while I'm at it.

Now that I've been working on the car a little while, I guess it's a good time to make a project thread.



pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #2, 01-03-2019 10:42 AM
      For the transmission, I decided to go with the Muncie 4-speed. Since this is my first real car project, I wanted something simple for a first-timer... I didn't want to pull a speed gear and have a bunch of needles fall all over the place.

I don't know how the Fiero Muncie will cope with more torque than stock, but Archie sold V8 kits to work with the stock transmission, so... I'll see what happens.
I made sure to use the ribbed case, not the smooth case.

Anyway, so here I am scavenging pieces from three Muncies, in order to make myself a good one:



I got a few brand-new parts to supplement the scavenged stuff.

Here, I clean the transmission case:



Closing up the transmission. From my collection of scavenged shims, I was able to shim the tapered roller bearings without having to buy or modify any shims.
I didn't have the required shifter shaft selective washer on hand, so I just machined the shift shaft to compensate.



I decided to use the complete 1984 M19 gearset.

I thought about using the 3.31/1.95 1st/2nd from the M17, since they're closer together than the 3.53/1.95 1st/2nd of the M19.
However, I wanted the deep 1st gear reduction.
My previous Fiero had an Isuzu transmission, and I learned to deal with the wide 1st/2nd gap. The M19 is no worse than what I've become used to.

All buttoned up:



Of course, an automatic car needs more than just a transmission! It needs a 3rd pedal:



And a shifter assembly. Before cleanup:



After cleanup:



Spadesluck MSG #3, 01-03-2019 11:08 AM
      I did that very same thing to my shifter. It looked terrible before rebuilding and painting it.

pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #4, 01-03-2019 11:16 AM
      The reverse interlock roller was actually seized. I worked it free, but I don't think it made a difference that could be felt by the driver.

Having the shifter cleaned up, it's like driving a freshly washed car with shiny paint. Even though it makes no functional difference, it's still more fun to drive. It's psychological.


BadNewsBrendan MSG #5, 01-03-2019 11:34 AM
      Wonder if I can convince my roommate to let me do the same thing with our dishwasher

pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #6, 01-03-2019 11:47 AM
      Well you clean off the majority of the gunk before sticking it in the dishwasher. That's just for the final touch of clean.

Then, you put the auto parts in the dishwasher without telling anyone; it's easier to ask for forgiveness than to ask for permission.

You can explain that whatever grime remains on the parts is no worse than last night's chicken wing grease that's slathered over the dish plates.


pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #7, 01-03-2019 12:10 PM
      For the engine, my friend gave me a 3.1 from a Chevrolet Beretta. Aside from the additional ~300 cc of displacement, I wanted it since it comes with a crankshaft position sensor.
The crankshaft position sensor provides the best possible angle information to the ECU, compared to using a distributor with slack in the timing chain.

Driving manners are important to me; for the ECU to do a good job, all its inputs have to be clean.

This is the setup I used to polish the #981 crankshaft's main journals.
I used the shoelace method for the throws.



I had the block decked to remove pitting that would prevent the head gasket from sealing, particularly since a turbo engine has more cylinder pressure than stock. I'm using the Fel-Pro MLS head gaskets.
I got hypereutectic dished pistons, 0.75 mm over.
The machinist bored the cylinders to 0.80 mm over, to give me a little more piston-to-wall clearance. From the turbo engine's extra heat, more clearance is needed to avoid seizing the piston in the bore.
I also filed the piston rings to have larger-than usual gaps, again to deal with the heat.

The displacement is 3192 cc with a compression ratio of 7.4.



The obligatory top end cover painting. I used single-stage DuPont (Axalta nowadays?) Nason paint.



Here I am inspecting the camshaft's lobe lift as I rotate the crankshaft.
The camshaft is a hydraulic flat tappet cam from Crower. I told them about my turbo build, and they specified it for me. It has a 114° LSA.
A Cloyes double-roller chain drives the camshaft.
I installed a high-volume oil pump.



The clutch is the RAM 9.75" HD unit from the Fiero Store. I know that some people use it with the Cadillac 4.9, so it should hold a decent amount of torque.
Eventually, as I crank up the boost pressure, the clutch might slip. Not a big deal, I'll change the clutch if there's an issue.

Making sure that the pressure plate won't rub the inside of the bellhousing:



Cylinder heads are stock. I didn't port the heads, as I didn't want to risk dinging the valve seats and needing a valve job (more expenditures).
I replaced the exhaust valves (pitted contact faces), and lapped all 12 valves.
Valve springs are new; they came with the camshaft.
I have 1.52 roller-tipped rockers for these heads.



Long block (mostly) complete:

[This message has been edited by pmbrunelle (edited 01-03-2019).]

pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #8, 01-03-2019 12:42 PM
      In a standard 90s GM setup, the crankshaft position sensor is wired to the DIS brick.

I don't want a DIS; I want my Fiero to have the classic distributor look. Hence, in this setup, the crank sensor is read "directly" by the ECU; no DIS brick in between.

I did, however, make a circuit to convert the crank sensor's weak analog signal into a robust digital signal.
It uses a Maxim MAX9924 integrated circuit to do the job.
The case is made from CNC-machined nylon 6/6.



The converter circuit is located as close as possible to the crank sensor, to reduce the chance of picking up noise in the leads.



The converter also provides threaded mounting holes for the GM knock sensor module, which goes right on top of it:



The modules are potted in urethane for sealing out the elements.
I made three of them, since if the module ever dies, I can't just walk into NAPA and get a replacement.
I left one module not potted; in case I discover a design flaw that led to the failure of the first two, I'd be able to make some changes before potting and installation into the car.



Here is a test I did, turning over the engine with the starter.
A tooth on the crankshaft is passing by the crankshaft sensor at the moment of this oscilloscope capture.

Top trace: analog signal from crankshaft position sensor
Bottom trace: digital signal sent to ECU

[This message has been edited by pmbrunelle (edited 01-03-2019).]

pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #9, 01-03-2019 01:01 PM
      Since the battery tray was falling apart, I decided to replace it with a new Fiero Store unit.

However, the root of (I think) the battery tray rust problem, common to many Fieros, is that the battery acid overflows and leaks onto the metal below.

Therefore, I decided to make a polypropylene battery tray. It is designed to channel any liquids to a drain fitting, on which a drain line can be installed to direct any liquids to the ground.



I also didn't like factory method of gripping the battery by the two lips at the bottom. I don't find the factory method secure enough, especially when the rust bug bites.

So, I decided to hold down the battery more positively, with a flatbar over the top and rods keeping the flatbar in its place.



pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #10, 01-03-2019 01:20 PM
      Since I want to put the turbo above the transmission, I moved the ignition coil over to the trunk wall to get it away from the heat.

As this engine won't have a working HEI module to fire the ignition coil, I installed a Bosch ignition module. This particular Bosch module came from an 80s Volvo.

In the Volvo application, the module is mounted on its own heatsink, which is then screwed onto the fender. I decided to use this entire module + heatsink assembly.
There were other heatsinks used with Bosch modules, but I liked the shape of this one for my Fiero.

[This message has been edited by pmbrunelle (edited 01-03-2019).]

pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #11, 01-03-2019 01:25 PM
      Well that just about sums up the major chunks of work completed so far.

As other blocks of work are completed, I'll post them. The next block of work to complete is the water injection system, followed by the distributor sensor, and everything else after that.


Daryl M (daryl.miglia@gmail.com) MSG #12, 01-03-2019 02:48 PM
      Very nice!

88Fingers (fredw_172@hotmail.com) MSG #13, 01-03-2019 07:24 PM
      Wow man! Wow! I am totally speechless, that's why I have to type this as I am speechless. What wonderful and innovative work you are doing PMB. You are making Canadian Fieros proud! Bravo!!

Raydar (raydarfiero@comcast.net) MSG #14, 01-03-2019 07:47 PM
     
 
quote
Originally posted by pmbrunelle:

In a standard 90s GM setup, the crankshaft position sensor is wired to the DIS brick.

I don't want a DIS; I want my Fiero to have the classic distributor look. Hence, in this setup, the crank sensor is read "directly" by the ECU; no DIS brick in between.

I did, however, make a circuit to convert the crank sensor's weak analog signal into a robust digital signal.
It uses a Maxim MAX9924 integrated circuit to do the job.
The case is made from CNC-machined nylon 6/6.

<snip>



Holy smokes, man!
You do some nice work!


pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #15, 01-03-2019 10:09 PM
      Thanks for the nice remarks.

Actually Raydar, I think I got the idea of the RAM HD clutch from one of your posts, where you said you were happy using it with your 4.9 Cadillac.

So I decided to buy the RAM HD clutch.

Afterwards, I saw a thread of yours where you mentioned that your RAM clutch blew up
I guess I'll see what happens!



Raydar (raydarfiero@comcast.net) MSG #16, 01-04-2019 03:08 PM
     
 
quote
Originally posted by pmbrunelle:

Thanks for the nice remarks.

Actually Raydar, I think I got the idea of the RAM HD clutch from one of your posts, where you said you were happy using it with your 4.9 Cadillac.

So I decided to buy the RAM HD clutch.

Afterwards, I saw a thread of yours where you mentioned that your RAM clutch blew up
I guess I'll see what happens!


Actually, that was a comedy of errors. (Ya' learn... ya' know?)

In the first place, the HTOB Getrag really requires a Cavalier clutch assembly. The Fiero clutch assembly is ~3/8" too tall (flywheel surface to tips of release fingers) to provide for adequate clutch wear.

In the second place, the depression in the center of the LSC flywheel was too small in diameter for that particular disk. The rivets around the edge of the hub actually made contact with the friction surface of the flywheel. Eventually, as the clutch wore, the rivets stopped the disk from pressing cleanly against the flywheel. These were NOT the rivets that held the lining to the disk. The disk was probably only about 10% worn, when the rivets started making themselves known.
I can send you links to pics of the "rivet" thing, if you'd like.

Nothing ever blew up. The clutch was fine. The application was... lacking.

Edit - My swap thread has been updated.
http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/098659.html

[This message has been edited by Raydar (edited 01-06-2019).]

2.5 MSG #17, 01-07-2019 11:23 AM
      Good stuff! Thanks for posting it
How did you refinish the shiftier mechanism parts that weren't painted?


pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #18, 01-07-2019 12:53 PM
      After taking the shifter apart, I sandblasted everything. Fast way to clean the spaces between the coils of the spring and other small places.

The sandblast takes off everything and leaves a rough surface that is good for paint to stick onto.

The sandblasted finish is also good at picking up other types of stains, and good at rusting.
I don't like the feel of sandblasted threads either.

So, for these other surfaces, I like to wirebrush them smooth, to make the rough sandblasted finish shiny.

Then, to protect (sort of) the unpainted surfaces, I rubbed motor oil on them, but since the shifter is in the cabin under the center console, I don't think the oil will be washed/rubbed away so easily.

From my time in the Militia, I know that guns require regular applications of oil to keep the rust at bay.

In this case, I would expect the metal to eventually become rusty, as I don't plan on regularly reapplying the oil... but since it took 30 years for the original shifter (which didn't have oil) to get light cosmetic rust, I think this shifter will be good for quite a while. Functional, at least.


2.5 MSG #19, 01-08-2019 08:51 AM
     
 
quote
Originally posted by pmbrunelle:

After taking the shifter apart, I sandblasted everything. Fast way to clean the spaces between the coils of the spring and other small places.

The sandblast takes off everything and leaves a rough surface that is good for paint to stick onto.

The sandblasted finish is also good at picking up other types of stains, and good at rusting.
I don't like the feel of sandblasted threads either.

So, for these other surfaces, I like to wirebrush them smooth, to make the rough sandblasted finish shiny.

Then, to protect (sort of) the unpainted surfaces, I rubbed motor oil on them, but since the shifter is in the cabin under the center console, I don't think the oil will be washed/rubbed away so easily.

From my time in the Militia, I know that guns require regular applications of oil to keep the rust at bay.

In this case, I would expect the metal to eventually become rusty, as I don't plan on regularly reapplying the oil... but since it took 30 years for the original shifter (which didn't have oil) to get light cosmetic rust, I think this shifter will be good for quite a while. Functional, at least.


Thanks.


fierosound (fierosound2@shaw.ca) MSG #20, 01-08-2019 11:11 AM
     
 
quote
Originally posted by pmbrunelle:

So I decided to buy the RAM HD clutch.

Afterwards, I saw a thread of yours where you mentioned that your RAM clutch blew up


Wonderful work pmbrunelle...

If the RAM clutch fails, consider Canadian made Bully Clutch. I have the same one in both my cars.
2 others here in Calgary have also bought them. (one is 3800 S/C, the other a 3400/Turbo)

We all got Stage 3. Light pedal effort, not "grabby" but high clamping and work great.
http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/129057.html




pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #21, 01-08-2019 12:35 PM
      I'll keep the Bully in mind. When I bought the RAM, I didn't do much research, I just picked an obvious choice.

Auto modification is a pretty expensive (at least the way I do it) hobby to have, and as most parts vendors are in the USA, I'm sending a lot of money outside of our country.

I kind of feel some remorse over what I'm doing, but not enough to stop auto modification.

For my next Fiero part, I have a quotation from an online Netherlands-based CNC machining service https://www.3dhubs.com ready to go.
However, I did send an RFQ to a local Grand-Mère machine shop, so if they want the job, I'll probably order from them.


hercimer01 MSG #22, 01-12-2019 12:06 AM
     

You're like some sort of Wizard or something?



pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #23, 02-09-2019 03:53 AM
      I (nearly) finished the distributor!

Since I want to run sequential fuel injection, just the crank sensor alone is not enough.
When the computer reads the double-notch on the crankshaft, that corresponds with TDC compression #1 AND TDC compression #4.
How to tell the two TDCs apart?

Following the double-notch, the computer will poll (read) the value from the distributor sensor, which shall be different for TDC #1 vs TDC #4.

For the electronics, I started by gutting some el-cheapo ignition modules. I just wanted them for their cases.


Modding the cases slightly so they can accept a PCB on top.
Someone who knows Fieros might notice that something's not stock when they see the coil connector on the left is missing.


Drawing the PCB on the computer:


A view of the module's interior, before closing it up:


Mounted on top of the PCB in through-hole fashion is the Allegro A1250 Hall-effect bipolar latch.
The legs are splayed to improve vibration resistance, and to make soldering easier.
Depending on the polarity (North or South) of the magnetic field going through the sensor, it will output zero or 5 volts.


These magnets are leftovers from work. They are isotropic injection-molded NdFeB with a PPS binder.
These particular examples have been diametrically magnetized.
One side of the magnet has a North pole; the other side a South pole.


The magnet is located in a groove in an aluminium hat (made by 3dhubs).
Silicone potting compound encapsulates the magnet to keep it in place and to protect it from the ozone.
The 12 mounting holes allow me to time the hat such that the North pole is centered around TDC #1, and the South pole around TDC #4.
Or vice versa; the polarity requirement can be switched in software.


The distributor was gutted and modified to accept the aluminium hat:


Here is the assembly:


All it needs now is some conformal coating to protect the Hall sensor, and some RTV to seal it up. Maybe a dab of RTV behind the Hall sensor too. Last, but not least, these modules need serial numbers.


Spadesluck MSG #24, 02-09-2019 11:04 PM
      Very cool stuff indeed!

pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #25, 03-23-2019 01:11 AM
      I figured that an air-to-air intercooler would be tricky to package (at a minimum involving bodywork + sanding), so I felt like trying a water injection system instead. NACA Report No. 756 describes the increase in boost pressure made possible (due to knock suppression) by water injection on a test engine... so why not try to duplicate those results?

This is the water tank I made. It is made of CNC-cut rigid PVC plastic panels glued together (with plumber's cement). The Holley water/meth pump (a re-labeled Shurflo diaphragm pump that I paid too much $$$ for) sucks water from the bottom of the tank.


The tank fits behind the RH quarter panel. No modification to the wheelwell liner is necessary. The top of the water level sending unit is visible; it drops into a hole at the top of the tank. This will allow me to install a water level gauge in the cabin, at a later date.


The first stop after the pump is the filter. From there, the water continues towards the pressure regulator, which is referenced to manifold pressure. A 0 - 5 V pressure transducer will allow the ECU to monitor the water pressure. Pressurized water is supplied to an Aquamist solenoid valve. A stainless braided hose carries the water from the solenoid valve to the engine. Since I'm using a return-type regulator, excess water is sent back to the water tank via the return line.


The connections to the water tank are below the battery tray (hence the battery tray is screwed in place, not welded). On the left is the return from the regulator. On the right, the fill line.


This is what the fill cap looks like from up above. I decided to engrave "ADI", which stands for Anti-Detonant Injection.


Here is a steel mount i made for the filler tube. Like most steel parts I make for this car, I sandblasted and POR-15ed it.


Another post detailing the intake tract mods for the water injection will follow!


tshark MSG #26, 03-23-2019 07:21 AM
      Just asking, but does the high-volume oil pump give you high oil pressure?

pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #27, 03-23-2019 10:10 AM
      There's a rudimentary "pressure regulator" in the oil pump cover (a flat disc and a spring, IIRC), so no, you don't get more maximum oil pressure due to the pump being high-volume.

However, at low RPM, when the oil pump isn't spinning fast, you'll have more oil pressure from the high-volume unit.

I'm using the Fiero 2.8 oil pan, so I decided that I wanted to use an oil pump sold for the Fiero 2.8, so that its pickup tube would be suited for my pan.

When researching whether I should use the standard-volume 2.8 pump or high-volume 2.8 pump, I found out that the high-volume 2.8 pump is the same pump as the standard pump sold for later-model 60° V6 engines, except for the Fiero-style pickup tube.

I figured that I couldn't go wrong with the standard pump for later generations of this engine family. I'm assuming that GM changed the volume to address some sort of reliability problem with the early incarnations of the 60° V6 (I might be wrong, but that's my guess).


pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #28, 03-23-2019 05:59 PM
      I re-purposed the IAC passage in the Fiero intake manifold for the water injection system.

After the machine work, I had the intake plated with electroless nickel (thanks olejoedad for advice) to protect it from corrosion due to the boost juice. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem to hold up to the methanol in windshield washer fluid, so I'll most likely be using distilled water from the pharmacy. I'll have to take some special precautions for winter storage of the car (maybe a purge with 50/50 antifreeze).


Water enters the main gallery, where it then goes out to the six ports.


The IAC passage outlets were drilled and tapped to 1/8" NPT. Just enough material was removed to clear the socket I intend to use for nozzle installation.


Here, the nozzles are installed. Since I used a gel-like thread sealant, I'll wait until next weekend before starting spray tests with water; I want to be sure that the sealant has cured.


The nozzles look like this (stock photo):


The nozzles use stainless steel construction, and include both a filter and check valve. The check valve will keep the IAC gallery full and primed after injection, ready to spray for the next shot.

Following advice from Blacktree, I selected check valve springs that are stiff enough to maintain a pressure of 35 psid when closed, to prevent the water from boiling off. Unsurprisingly (when you buy things from alibaba), the non-specified stock springs were no good for my application; I ordered three kinds of springs from Century Spring and I picked the ones that worked best.

****************************************

Since I repurposed the IAC passage in the intake manifold for water injection, what to do with the IAC airflow?

I plugged the stock IAC outlet, and by drilling an angled hole, the IAC airflow is re-introduced immediately after the throttle plate. Since the angled hole intersects the throttle body's coolant passage, I also blocked off the coolant ports (my Fiero won't have the throttle body heat feature anymore).


Spadesluck MSG #29, 03-23-2019 07:43 PM
      I like the way you blocked of the ports on the TB. Never thought about using brass plugs to clean that up. Do you remember the pitch of those plugs by chance because I would like to steal your idea!

pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #30, 03-23-2019 11:26 PM
      Those are actually the stock brass tube nuts (with their O-ring seals) that come with the factory coolant lines. In my setup, these plugs have to seal well, or else I'll have a boost/vacuum leak.

Since the tube nuts have holes in them, I soldered in a piece of scrap steel rod with plumber's solder and flux. I then faced the ends square and smooth on the lathe. Someone without a lathe could use a hacksaw and file to achieve an equivalent result.

When you look at the modified piece from the end, there's brass on the outside, and steel on the inside. So, I painted the end black to hide the inconsistent materials, and since unpainted steel would rust anyway.



In your case, if you don't have the stock tube nuts anymore, I can think of two alternatives:

1. Try something threaded, such as a bolt. The measurements of the factory tube nut are consistent with that of a 7/16"-20 UNF thread.
The under-head length of the factory tube nut is 5/8".


2. Tap a freeze plug into the counterbore, which measures 12 mm in diameter.
After a quick search I found these which would probably work:
Melling MPC-108 (normal freeze plug)
Melling MPC-108V (with small venting hole in the middle)


pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #31, 03-27-2019 09:11 PM
      Well, when I started the dream of having a turbo Fiero some 10-odd years ago, I bought myself an ebay turbo.

Since I plan on installing the turbo soon, I decided to do some last-minute checks:


In this graph I am overlaying the engine's expected working points over the map of my compressor.

Basically, this turbo does not appear to fit whatsover with my engine. When I bought the turbo, I didn't know how to interpret a compressor map.

Now I'm investigating if I can just change compressor wheels (T04B S-trim or T04B V-trim), or maybe I want to change the entire turbo. To avoid throwing away too much hardware, I want to stay with an internally wastegated T3 turbine, and a compressor housing with a 2.75" inlet / 2" discharge. The Garrett GT3071R appears to be a good match, but I don't know if I want to spend for a whole new turbo. On the other hand, being too much of a cheapskate is expensive when things go wrong, so further study is required.


pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #32, 03-30-2019 01:05 AM
      First "smoke test" of water injection system.
https://youtu.be/MJUYM5QOWno

So far, everything looks good!

Soon I'll pick what pressure regulator setting I want, and then I'll measure the flow for different duty cycles and different RPMs.


tiretread (rthomas34@hotmail.com) MSG #33, 04-08-2019 03:16 PM
      Threads like this make me feel entirely inadequate. I'm happy if I get my shoe laces done right. Amazing stuff.

Spadesluck MSG #34, 04-08-2019 03:45 PM
     
 
quote
Originally posted by pmbrunelle:

First "smoke test" of water injection system.
https://youtu.be/MJUYM5QOWno

So far, everything looks good!

Soon I'll pick what pressure regulator setting I want, and then I'll measure the flow for different duty cycles and different RPMs.


I also think when everything is bolted up and running dripping will not be an issue as it is going to be sucked into the motor.


pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #35, 04-09-2019 07:59 AM
      My winter boots have zippers running up each side. That's how I stay focused enough to do car work

I tried blowing compressed air into the runner (an attempt to simulate a running engine) while it was spraying, and it didn't seem to have much effect on the dripping. These nozzles have a cone angle of about 70°; perhaps a narrower cone angle would be better.

Gasoline is injected at pretty much the same location, and it too does partially condense on the walls before being picked up by the airflow... This time delay of fuel lazing around in puddles of liquid before making it into the combustion chamber is why we need acceleration enrichment, or else you get a lean spot on throttle tip-in.

So, since water evaporates less readily than gasoline, I think I should expect similar or greater (water) puddling in the intake ports... and technically speaking, I should also use acceleration enrichment for the water injection, in order to deliver the requested amount of water into the combustion chamber.

[This message has been edited by pmbrunelle (edited 04-09-2019).]

Spadesluck MSG #36, 04-09-2019 12:27 PM
      The water is really only going to be injected under acceleration correct? The chances of puddling I think is going to be very low because the motor is going to act like a vacuum cleaner at this point at sucking everything in.

pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #37, 04-09-2019 08:58 PM
      I'll only spray in high boost (whatever "high" turns out to be), in conditions where the 91 pump gas doesn't have enough octane to resist detonation.
I don't expect the turbo to spool off-idle either, so there will be some RPMs (maybe 3000) before the spray begins.

I ordered the turbo today, and as getting parts in Canada sometimes goes, I'll get it in a month. That gives me some time to work out the kinks with the water injection system, before I assemble the top end of the engine and fit the turbo.

I didn't want to spend too much for a turbo, but I didn't want a cheap knockoff that cannot be trusted, so I ordered a new Garrett-brand T04E 50 trim / Stage 3 .63 A/R journal bearing turbo. I already bought some intake and exhaust plumbing parts; this turbo is compatible with the hardware I already have.

In my research, I was really impressed with the Borg-Warner EFR line of turbos. To begin with the accessories, they have integrated wastegates and blow-off valves! That's a lot of installation headaches saved! Then, the compressor maps... they just work with a really wide range of pressures and airflows. The EFR turbos start at about twice what I spent for my journal-bearing Garrett. However, I'm sure they're worth every penny. For someone doing a more costly / high-end build than what I'm doing, that's what I'd suggest.


pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #38, 04-21-2019 11:20 PM
      The water injection is coming along; I measured the amount of water sprayed as I varied the electrical pulse width. I'll use this information to help me set up / tune the MS3 once the car is up and running.



It takes about 4 ms for the solenoid to open; pulses shorter than that don't allow any water through.

At higher speeds, the solenoid valve (well, the entire system) isn't fast enough to allow for fine control; it's more of an on/off thing.

At lower speeds where the valve can be better-controlled, I'll be able to cut back on the water flow to avoid drowning the engine, and to reduce water consumption.

********************************************************************************

I have a small vibration problem to deal with; it appears that the pulsating flow from the water pump can cause a "water hammer" effect in the water lines and regulator. I'm going to try a length of soft hose to remedy the issue.

[This message has been edited by pmbrunelle (edited 04-21-2019).]

pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #39, 04-24-2019 09:10 PM
      The following day, I re-did the curves, but while connected to the alternator of my truck, which was idling for the duration of the test.

I wanted to see the difference between running off a battery vs. an alternator.

With the greater voltage, the valve seems to snap open a bit faster.

The difference is most apparent in the high-RPM curves (6000 and 7000). These curves have more of a linear zone where the amount of water injected varies linearly with the pulse width.



Question for anyone with ideas... so I'll have to use studs to mount my new turbo to the T3 flange on the exhaust. I can't physically insert bolts into the holes on the turbine housing's flange.

The T3 flange on the exhaust has tapped through-holes. What is the proper way to install a stud so that it won't loosen? Anti-seize, special threadlocker? What kind of nut do I need?


pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #40, 05-15-2019 10:45 PM
      I presently have an unbranded eBay blow-off valve with no specifications; like I did with the turbo, my goal is to rid this car of most of its iffy eBay parts.

So now, I'm shopping for a BOV.

Ideally, one that vents to atmosphere, rather than recirculating into the air filter can, for the simple reason of simplifying the plumbing.

I've been looking at the Turbosmart Vee Port Pro - Black:
http://www.turbosmartdirect...-Port-Pro-Black.html

What seems to be a common theme among BOV manufacturers is selection of a BOV spring based on your engine's idle vacuum. At idle, the spring should be strong enough to keep the BOV shut despite the vacuum trying to open it.

OK, but then what about during high-RPM closed-throttle deceleration? My Fiero engine which idles with 18 inHg of vacuum now goes up to 26 inHg of vacuum. I asked Turbosmart Tech Support about this, and they suggested that yes, the BOV may open during deceleration.

I don't know if I'm missing something, but it appears that atmospheric BOVs may allow the ingestion of unfiltered air

TiAL also has a BOV spring selection chart that is based on idle vacuum (their tech support hasn't yet returned my inquiry)

I could stick with the recirculating type BOV that sends the air back to the air filter can (sucking from the filter on decel would be OK too), but it's more fabrication work. I could also just stick a K&N filter on the outlet barb fitting of a recirculating BOV, but then that becomes an additional maintenance item.

If I go for a recirculating BOV, I'm considering the 1G DSM unit.

[This message has been edited by pmbrunelle (edited 05-15-2019).]

pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #41, 05-16-2019 07:42 PM
      TiAL acknowledged that yes, the BOV will open during overrun.

However, they maintained that positive pressure will be maintained upstream of the throttle body whenever the BOV opens... I guess because the turbo is spinning anytime the engine is running. So normally, dirt should not come in; it should be blown out.

They did suggest that if I was driving in a very dusty/dirty environment, then a conservative approach would be to use their recirculating BOV, either with a small air filter on it, or routed back to the airbox.


Spadesluck MSG #42, 05-17-2019 11:34 AM
      I have never given much thought to a BOV ingesting during deceleration not have I seen any talk about it. Most just talk about the springs rates for opening and closing during desired operations. I myself would not be overly concerned about it. I would be most concerned for the BOV working properly during let off so I do not hurt the motor.

pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #43, 06-09-2019 10:19 PM
      I finished the exhaust up to the turbine inlet. I am using the stock log manifolds, but with bellows in between the ports. With the bellows, each segment of the exhaust can grow independently as they get hot, without developing undue stress.
The same reasoning applies to the bellows in the crossover pipe.



The bellows fit underneath the stock front manifold heat shield, provided that I hammered the AC compressor clearance bump flat. Since I don't have AC, no problem there.
I'm using the Volkswagen exhaust port gaskets. They have a stainless steel exterior; looks like they won't blow out.



The compressor housing is quite close to the shift cables, but I should still be able to install/uninstall them. I successfully tested this theory with the engine+cradle in the car, as if I were doing it for real.
The shift cables come really close to the crossover pipe; I'll have to come up with some sort of heat shield, in addition to the insulating sleeves that come on the Rodney Dickman cables.



Right now the turbo is supported only by the exhaust. An additional support to hold the turbo's weight is presently in the works.



La fiera MSG #44, 06-28-2019 10:02 PM
     
 
quote
Originally posted by pmbrunelle:

I finished the exhaust up to the turbine inlet. I am using the stock log manifolds, but with bellows in between the ports. With the bellows, each segment of the exhaust can grow independently as they get hot, without developing undue stress.
The same reasoning applies to the bellows in the crossover pipe.



The bellows fit underneath the stock front manifold heat shield, provided that I hammered the AC compressor clearance bump flat. Since I don't have AC, no problem there.
I'm using the Volkswagen exhaust port gaskets. They have a stainless steel exterior; looks like they won't blow out.



The compressor housing is quite close to the shift cables, but I should still be able to install/uninstall them. I successfully tested this theory with the engine+cradle in the car, as if I were doing it for real.
The shift cables come really close to the crossover pipe; I'll have to come up with some sort of heat shield, in addition to the insulating sleeves that come on the Rodney Dickman cables.



Right now the turbo is supported only by the exhaust. An additional support to hold the turbo's weight is presently in the works.



Nice set up! When is it going to be ready?!


pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #45, 06-28-2019 11:58 PM
      Hopefully I'll be able to take the car for a spin a few times sometime before it snows, around November.
I've done a good amount of the work so far; I see the light at the end of the tunnel.

I try to think a few steps ahead, so that I have the right parts/supplies already on hand when I need them.

I've been thinking about the first startup, and how I should use motor oil with ZDDP or other magical ingredients to reduce the risk of wiping a cam lobe in the first half-hour of life.
So far, I have identified Redline-brand oil as a candidate:
https://www.redlineoil.com/15w40-diesel-motor-oil
I can buy this locally.

It says "WITH EXTRA ZDDP FOR WEAR CONTROL" right on the bottle.

Previously, I used 15W-40 Shell Rotella T in my Fiero, but as time goes on, I'm not even sure if that's good oil anymore.

Canadian Tire has this fake zinc stuff:
https://www.canadiantire.ca...ditive-0380268p.html
However, the Hy-per Lube doesn't have the reputation of ZDDP, so I don't feel like betting my engine on it.

[This message has been edited by pmbrunelle (edited 06-29-2019).]

Dennis LaGrua (dlagrua@comcast.net) MSG #46, 06-29-2019 09:05 AM
      Very Impressive build, neat, clean and well put together. Your knowledge of automotive electronics is also a cut above the rest. The engine should really run nice.



Frenchrafe (rafe.rainbird@yahoo.com) MSG #47, 06-29-2019 11:42 AM
      Like Denis said: Very impressive build!

I had been tempted to do up my old 2.8 into a turbo setup, rather like that Fiero that lives in Norway I belive.

Good on you to do such a well thought out 60° V6 turbo build!

Rafe

PS : Thanks for the tip in using bellows on the exhaust manifold logs - I'll be doing this the next time when mine crack again!



pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #48, 06-29-2019 08:38 PM
     
 
quote
Originally posted by Dennis LaGrua:
Your knowledge of automotive electronics is also a cut above the rest.


I work in the design of automotive electronics, so that may clarify things...

 
quote
Originally posted by Frenchrafe:
PS : Thanks for the tip in using bellows on the exhaust manifold logs - I'll be doing this the next time when mine crack again!


I think it's a good idea, but I'll only know for sure once I have some miles on the car!

[This message has been edited by pmbrunelle (edited 06-29-2019).]

pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #49, 06-30-2019 04:29 PM
      Here the turbo support is installed. Its function is to support the weight of the turbo, to take the weight off the crossover pipe.

I'm using a RH-LH pair of 7/16"-20 rod ends threaded into a hex rod. Since the crossover pipe sags by 0.008" under the weight of the turbo, I simply crank up the rod-end assembly to raise the turbo's position by 0.008". The idea is to put the crossover pipe into its "zero-stress" position.



I was inspired by seeing many 80s turbo Formula 1 engines having this kind of setup.

Honda RA166E: https://upload.wikimedia.or..._Collection_Hall.jpg
Renault EF4: https://upload.wikimedia.or...n_Player_Special.jpg
TAG-Porsche: https://upload.wikimedia.or...t_Porsche_Museum.jpg

However, it's not because this design is found on race cars that it's suitable for a street car. I guess I'll see what happens.


Will (william.lucke@gmail.com) MSG #50, 07-01-2019 09:48 AM
      That does look like a fun setup. Do you have your plate laser or water-jet cut?

pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #51, 07-01-2019 07:43 PM
      Most of the steel plates I'm cutting with a hacksaw, angle grinder + cutoff wheel, drill press for internal corners. Bench grinder and files for the last bits of material removal.

Either I'm making 1:1 paper/cardboard models, and tracing the result on the steel, or I'm drawing lines directly on the steel with a ruler, compass, etc.

Only for the more "precision" work, or for shapes that would be a PITA to do with hand tools, then I make a *.dxf drawing, which I have cut by a metal shop in my town. They have a plasma-cutting table.

If we look at the turbo support components, the turbine housing clamping plates were something I outsourced. I made this *.dxf and had it cut from stainless:



On the other hand, the bottom mount that bolts to the transaxle was easily within my capabilities. I did the design in cardboard, traced it in steel, and then cut it out:



It was just faster and easier to DIY it. I sidestepped the difficulty of digitizing a semi-arbitrary shape (as opposed to something easy to measure, such as a circle or rectangle). Outsourcing also brings the administrative burden of having to keep tabs on the supplier.


Will (william.lucke@gmail.com) MSG #52, 07-03-2019 09:55 AM
      LOL at seeing dimensions in inches on a drawing labeled in French...

pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #53, 07-20-2019 08:36 PM
      I finished the air pipe linking the turbo's compressor outlet to the throttle body:


I ended up going with the Turbosmart Vee Port Pro BOV. It's rated to be capable of venting 600 hp of compressed air, whereas the TiAL Q is rated at 1800 hp... which is overkill for my Fiero. The Turbosmart unit is physically smaller than the TiAL piece, hence I decided to go with the more compact, easier-to-package solution:


Here is the GM 3-port boost control solenoid (used on the Syclone/Typhoon). This will be computer-controlled, allowing the computer to increase the boost pressure beyond the wastegate spring setting:


Fiero38SC (jrhaughey@gmail.com) MSG #54, 07-22-2019 08:49 AM
      Awesome work. Please keep it coming.

pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #55, 07-29-2019 12:43 PM
      I installed the TiAL MVI 2.5 wastegate actuator.

Its opening pressure is configurable by installing different combinations of springs:
http://www.tialsport.com/do...vi2.5springchart.JPG

I own the red and green springs, which should provide enough flexibility for me. I expect to fine-tune the boost pressure with the electronic solenoid, rather than by spring selection.

I got the bent-rod version of the actuator, so that it would clear the compressor housing.



John W. Tilford (johntilford@comcast.net) MSG #56, 08-02-2019 08:20 AM
      Did this Fiero have any Kentucky owner history? It looks so much like my first Fiero, a 1986 white/black notchie with the same interior colors, and 2.5 "Iron Duke". The Kentucky buyer called me about an hour after driving away . . "How do I get this gas filler cap cover open?"



pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #57, 08-02-2019 10:14 AM
      It's definitely not your old Fiero. Mine has the (Canadian market) Z49 RPO code, and it still had an Ontarian car dealer sticker on the decklid when I took possession; seems like it spent its life in Canada. Additionally, mine is a 1985, and came with the 2.8 V6.

When I bought my first Fiero, I too struggled at the gas station with trying to find the filler cap release!

White bumperpad notchies were one of the most commonly produced Fiero body styles.


pmbrunelle (pmbrunelle@gmail.com) MSG #58, 08-18-2019 12:12 AM
      The powertrain is in the car (for the moment), and everything seems to fit.

The main steps remaining before driving the car are to fabricate the exhaust piping from the turbine outlet all the way to the exit, and lastly tweaking the wiring harness as needed.