World's slowest Fiero/Quad 4 Swap
Topic started by: Quad Raider, Date: 07-15-2017 09:17 PM
Original thread: http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/097646.html


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #1, 07-15-2017 09:17 PM
      I've always planned to post a thread about my engine swap, but figured I'd do it once the swap was complete and the car was on the road. But since it's taking so long, I decided to go ahead and start the thread in spite of all the work I have left to do.

The other reason for starting the thread now is to hopefully break the curse that's befallen my family's cars. As I've posted in other threads, every time I make significant headway on the Fiero, something goes wrong with one of the other cars in the family. Most recently my wife's 2002 Grand Prix GTP 40th Anniversary edition suddenly needed transmission work, then on Monday she hit a deer, or more precisely the deer hit her car, causing major damage.

http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/096018.html
http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/093322.html

Here's the donor:


My brother bought this 1992 Quasar Blue Beretta GTZ in 2007 in St. Louis. I went up there with him to look at it then drove his truck home after he bought it. It had the H.O. Quad in it, which I believe is the second most powerful Quad GM offered, after the W41 version sold in the Olds 442 (the Quad is an Oldsmobile engine, after all).

Roger drove the GTZ for about six months and then it blew a head gasket. He gave it to me and I fixed the HG and made some other repairs and then drove it every day for four years. I work in downtown Tulsa and my commute is about 30 miles each way. I fell in love with that car. So much power but I'd get 30+ mpg on the highway. The AC didn't work, the suspension was worn out and the sunroof leaked, but damn it was fun to drive, especially up an on ramp.

Some time near the end of those 4 years, I got into the car to leave work and the seat fell over backwards. When I pulled up the carpet to see what the problem was, I was stunned to see a giant rust hole. I welded in some replacement steel and eventually tried replacing the whole driver's side floor pan, but the rust was just too much, so I started looking around for a replacement. I wanted another GTZ but couldn't find one in at least decent shape. Then one morning on the drive to work I saw a Fiero heading the opposite direction. I asked my brother Roger about swapping the engine/transmission from the GTZ into a Fiero and he loved the idea. He had owned two Fiero GTs and a couple other GTZs over the years and knew instantly what a great combo they'd be.



I found a 1987 Coupe in Fayetteville, Arkansas and we went to look at it on New Year's Day 2011. The original owner was selling it because it had quit the previous October and she just didn't want to deal with it anymore. She still loved the car but was ready for something else. On the way over to look at it, we passed through the town of Cincinnati, Arkansas where a tornado had hit the night before. Maybe that was a signal that things wouldn't go as planned.

Two weeks later we went back to pick up the car and bring it home. The plan was to paint the car and make the modifications I wanted, then put the GTZ engine and transmission in it. I thought it would take about 6 months, total. Nine months later, my Quad's timing chain tensioner broke and the engine chewed up its timing gears and bent four valves, so that was the first major change in the plan.

The biggest problem was the sudden loss of my brother last August. He died of sudden cardiac arrest. It's been hard, at times, to work on the car since then, but I know he would want me to finish it and I'm determined to do so.

So here's what I've done to the car:
-rebuilt headlight motors
-repaired broken headlight door frame
-repaired broken horn buttons
-fabricated under-spare battery tray
-fabricated Quad 4/Getrag mounts
-modified cradle to fit Quad 4
-installed solid cradle mounts
-shortened rear tie rods 3"/moved mounts
-converted to sunroof
-disassembled Quad
-obtained/painted GTZ wheels
-fabricated custom center wheel caps

I will post more photos. Right now I have them saved on three or four different devices but now that I've started this thread it will be easier to collect and post them.

Right now the body panels are off the car and I'm sanding and priming them. More on that soon.

Over the 6 and 1/2 years, here are the extra items I've collected:
-two doors with power windows and locks
-two power window/lock wiring harnesses
-three sets of seats
-three sets of sail panels
-two extra front fascias
-'88 rear fascia
-'88 deck lid with wing
-'88 cradle and rear suspension
-two extra Quad 4s
-extra Getrag

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 07-15-2017).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #2, 07-15-2017 09:20 PM
      Here are the two cars together shortly after we got the Fiero back to Oologah.



There was a stick of firewood propped under the right headlight. The paint and interior were rough but the car was almost 100% complete, and it was a 5-speed so I bought it.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 06-27-2018).]

bjm362 MSG #3, 07-15-2017 09:33 PM
      Glad to see a post not to far from my neck of the woods! I used to go swimming up by Oolagah!!!
BTW, nice find. I need to get lucky and find a complete car in need of some attention to detail for the right price!!


sardonyx247 (sardonyx247@yahoo.com) MSG #4, 07-16-2017 08:37 AM
      You would think it is the slowest quad4 swap, I was starting mine over a decade ago, I was going to go turbo.
But right as I was going to buy my forged pistons, my GT came for sale, and used the money for that. Then blew my engine on the way home, see my GT sitting there with no engine I went to "just quickly throw one in" and started with the whole 3.4 game, I just never quit with the GT. I had all the parts for the quad, plus many extras, but over 10 years later I got a quad drop out from Fierobssed (total thanks) and decide to finish it. Plus at the time there was no way to program the ECM as the whole turbo Idea, I got the quad forum, (when it first started) to bug tunerCAT non stop until they came out with the code, but by then I took my turbo knowledge and put it into my GT.

On the plus side, with all the info I gathered over the years I was able to assemble the biggest collection of Quad 4 info in one place anywhere on the net, right here on PFF.
And with the pallet of Quad parts I have, if you need something, let me know.

The Quad should have been the stock 4 cyl in the Fiero, to bad it didn't come out until after it's demise.

Good luck on the swap, yea another Quad 4 Fiero!!!!!



Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #5, 07-16-2017 09:14 AM
     
 
quote
Originally posted by sardonyx247:

On the plus side, with all the info I gathered over the years I was able to assemble the biggest collection of Quad 4 info in one place anywhere on the net, right here on PFF.
And with the pallet of Quad parts I have, if you need something, let me know.

The Quad should have been the stock 4 cyl in the Fiero, to bad it didn't come out until after it's demise.

Good luck on the swap, yea another Quad 4 Fiero!!!!!



Thank you. I've used your thread for reference a lot already.

A couple years ago I accidentally deleted all the photos on my phone. They included all the pictures I took while disassembling the car. I had saved some of them along the way for various reasons so I'll share what I have, but reassambly will be more challenging.


Lunatic (shaynes@rogers.com) MSG #6, 07-16-2017 07:56 PM
      If you were closer, I'd certainly lend you a hand working on this Quad 4 swap. On another forum, there's a guy selling a Quad 4 Fiero for cheap. Road trip with a trailer?
Check it out here.


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #7, 07-16-2017 10:44 PM
      Thanks, Lunatic. I know from reading your thread you do great work.

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #8, 07-17-2017 08:25 PM
      I'm having trouble tracking down photos of some of the work I've already done. For instance, I can't find the pictures I took while I was mating the Quad to the Fiero's cradle. They're probably on one of my old phones. (side note: One of the many lessons I've learned on this build: use one device for taking and storing photos during a project).

Since the HO Quad from my GTZ is disassembled, I used one of my spare quads to fabricate the engine and transmission mounts. Early on my plan was to rebuild my HO and install it in the car, THEN do the bodywork and paint and finish the interior. That changed because I started buying body and other parts and the shop was so cramped it was difficult to get anything done. Plus, I came across a sunroof car in the salvage yard and this forum convinced me to switch over (what a huge load of work that was, since I had to rebuild the first sunroof panel I bought because I broke the A pillars getting it off the donor car). So I switched gears, deciding to do the body work and get the panels installed on the car, then worry about the engine and the rest of the mechanical work.

Right now the engine and transmission mounts are just roughed in. I need to weld in some extra bracing and paint them, so I'll post photos once I'm done with the body work and pull the cradle out again.

This is one of my spare Quads sitting in the car. As you can see it fits great, like it was meant to be there.



Notice that the exhaust side of the Quad is to the back of the car. This is important for another reason.



Moving the battery to the front of the car really helps open space.



I was very careful when fabricating the mounts to make sure I'd have room to close the deck lid without having to modify it. Some owners have had to cut away part of the deck lid frame because the Quad is so much taller than the Duke. There's a sweet spot where the crank pulley sits about 3/4" above the cradle and the top of the engine clears the deck lid by about a quarter of an inch. Again, pictures of this step to come later.

The AC compressor on the Quad sits much lower than on the Duke, so the exhaust hump has to be modified. Some owners just cut a small part off the arch, but I decided to remove it altogether since there's no reason for it with a Quad.



I used some scrap 3" square tubing. I wish I'd taken more photos of the process.



Right now I'm sanding and priming the body. More on that in a future post.


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #9, 07-18-2017 08:08 PM
      Here are some more photos of how the engine fits in the car.

As I mentioned, it's possible to get the engine and trans to fit without having to modify the decklid.


It's been so long since I did the work, I'd forgotten how well everything fits.



I got to this point by putting the cradle on my heavy duty welding table, then lowering the Quad/Getrag onto it. Unfortunately, the photos I took of the process were some of the ones I accidentally deleted. I used blocks of wood and a level to get the engine to sit where I wanted, then fabricated the mounts to fit.

There were two basic engine mount designs for factory Quads. The Grand Am type has a mount on the intake side and one on the exhaust side. The GTZ type is similar to the Iron Duke type, with a u-shaped flange around the oil pan that sits on a big rubber mount bolted to a plate. At first I was planning to convert to the Grand Am type, mostly because that was the kind I found in other swaps. After I cut the flange off my cradle I realized how similar the Duke/GTZ mounts were and changed my mind (a common theme in this swap), so I had to weld in a new flange. It worked out OK because that made it possible to put the flange where I wanted it.

I decided I didn't want the oil pan to be flush with the bottom of the cradle, so I used a piece of 1/4" plywood to raise it up a bit.




There is some surface rust on my welds because the Fiero had to spend some time outdoors due to the aforementioned major repairs to other cars in the family. Once I'm done with the painting and have reassembled the body, I will pull the engine and cradle and take care of all of this.

Here's the AC bracket on the Quad. You can see how low it sits on the engine, requiring modification of the exhaust hump.


These pictures show how I shortened the tie rods by 3". I found several pages on the internet discussing the poor geometry of the design and the recommendation to move the pivots at least 2" toward the outside. I had the time so I decided to go 3". Discovering whether this was a good idea is one of the great mysteries I hope to solve by finishing the swap.



One cool feature of this swap is that the Fiero axles fit the Quad's Getrag. These photos also show how I converted to solid mounts on the cradle. I cut a short section of pipe and welded it onto the cradle.



sardonyx247 (sardonyx247@yahoo.com) MSG #10, 07-19-2017 08:09 AM
      I used the hump in the cradle to run my coolant pipe under it. Fits perfect in the hump.

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #11, 07-19-2017 08:35 PM
      Found some of the photos from the process of mounting the Quad to the Fiero cradle.

I noticed that the stock Isuzu transmission mounts were very close to fitting the GTZ's Getrag, so I modified them as a starting point.




It's been so long I don't remember exactly what I did to the rear mount. I think I had to cut one side of it and add some metal.

The front transmission mount was more straightforward. The mounting holes lined up, but part of the metal on the mount had to be removed.
(Sorry for the blurry photos)



I decided this wouldn't be strong enough, so I used a piece of wide angle iron for the vertical piece. I can't find a picture of it so it'll have to wait until I can take some new ones.

In a previous post I said the clearance issue was with the crank pulley but that's incorrect. The issue is with the transmission. With the engine sitting level, there's a spot where the decklid is about 1/4" above the timing cover while the transmission is about a half an inch from the driver's side frame rail. It took a while, maybe a few hours over a couple of days, to get the engine/transmission to sit in that spot.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 07-22-2017).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #12, 07-21-2017 07:54 PM
      Here are photos of the Grand Am type of Quad engine mounts. I don't know where I got these pictures, possibly from a thread on this forum:




These mounts obviously work fine, but I just didn't want to clutter up the engine compartment this way.


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #13, 07-21-2017 08:03 PM
      As I mentioned, I was still driving my GTZ as I began working on the Fiero when the timing chain tensioner broke and the Quad chewed up its timing gears and chain. The Quad is an interference engine, so the engine bent four valves.



I don't think the head is damaged, but I will check when I get to that point in the reassembly.

The Quad has a rather long timing chain, which is kept tight by the tensioner shoe between the crank and the water pump sprocket. This photo is of one of my spare Quads. The tensioner shoe on my HO broke in half, right about where the spring is, allowing the tensioner to tighten the chain too much and screw up the timing, too.




Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #14, 07-21-2017 08:05 PM
      This is an interesting comparison between different Quads. The exhaust pipe on the top is from the HO Quad out of my GTZ. The one on the bottom is from a regular Quad out of a Grand Am.




Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #15, 07-21-2017 08:14 PM
      My GTZ came with aftermarket wheels that I never really liked. After I junked it, I came across a set of GTZ wheels in the salvage yard and bought them on sale for $100.



I then spent many months trying to find the other three center caps. One day while checking the salvage I saw a set of Grand Am hubcaps with center sections that looked like they would fit. Here's the thread about the conversion:

http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/095502.html

Edit: Can't believe that was two years ago.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 07-21-2017).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #16, 07-21-2017 08:28 PM
      Here's what the car looked like when I first started working on it on March 6th, 2011. When I saved this photo I made a note that I'd finally finished working on the engine in my daughter's car. I don't remember which daughter, which car or what the problem was with the engine.



The car was pretty tired. The seats had three covers on them. I guess the original owner would get tired of one and just put the new one right over it. The passenger seat is actually in decent shape, except that she spilled a whole bottle of perfume or air freshener on it.



The headliner was toast, but it doesn't matter anymore since I switched over to a sunroof.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 07-21-2017).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #17, 07-21-2017 08:44 PM
      Here are more photos of how I shortened the rear tie rods. I read a lot of posts about the bad geometry of the '84-'87 rear ends and finally settled on moving the mounts 3" toward the outside of the cradle.

The first step was cutting the tie rod, putting a piece of thick-walled pipe over one end, welding the tie rod and grinding the weld, then sliding the pipe over the junction and welding each end of it.





Heavy-walled C channel worked for new mounts. I lined up the mounting holes then lined up the mount and welded it on. This took a while because of all the grinding required.





I'm confident the modifications will be strong enough, but obviously I have no idea if they'll actually work and eliminate bump steer. Hopefully they won't CAUSE any problems.



Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #18, 07-21-2017 08:48 PM
      Side note about my blurry photos. They're not a problem anymore for two reasons. One, I have a Galaxy S8 now and its camera is spectacular. Two, last summer my doctor convinced me to quit wearing a contact in my right eye. I'm near-sighted but my right eye isn't too bad. Wearing contacts in both eyes required me to wear reading glasses, which was a pain and I often didn't do it, especially working in the shop.

It took me about two weeks to get used to it, but the difference is amazing. If I need to focus up close, my brain automatically uses my right eye.


sardonyx247 (sardonyx247@yahoo.com) MSG #19, 07-22-2017 08:49 AM
      I think ideally would be to move the tie rods to the control arms, but yet I have never seen anyone do it, except the "bump steer kit" It would completely eliminate the bump steer.

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #20, 07-25-2017 09:27 PM
     
 
quote
Originally posted by sardonyx247:

I think ideally would be to move the tie rods to the control arms, but yet I have never seen anyone do it, except the "bump steer kit" It would completely eliminate the bump steer.


That's an interesting concept.


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #21, 07-25-2017 09:53 PM
      I've been working an evening shift for the last week, so my mornings have been free to work on the car. I put off removing the door skins as long as I possibly could, but the time finally came as I prepare to paint. I found some surprises.

The driver's side door handle has always been loose. Here's why:



I think the previous owner had someone try to fix the door handle for her and whoever it was may have gotten carried away. This brace looks like it was deliberately cut.




Since my dew wipes were in bad shape, the doors were full of crap, including a giant wasp nest.




Three or four years ago I ordered raw dew wipe material, planning to drill out the rivets on the old ones and move the flanges and felts to the new stuff. Well, to continue the theme of this build, that plan has been scrapped. The felts on my wipes are horrible.





I'll be ordering new dew wipes as soon as I can afford it.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 07-25-2017).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #22, 07-31-2017 08:24 PM
      On Saturday we had a family get-together to celebrate my older brother's birthday. I took advantage of all the manpower and got my two brothers and a nephew to help me roll the car out of the shop, turn it around and put it back in the shop nose out. It's funny how a simple change can provide such a big lift. Aside from the times when it had to sit outside, it's been in the shop, "nose in," since early 2011.

I'm still sanding and priming body panels and hoping to paint in a couple of weeks. My wife and I are taking a trip next week so i won't make much progress for a while.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 07-31-2017).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #23, 08-01-2017 10:39 PM
      Found some more old photos. These are pictures of one of my spare Quads. This came out of an '89 Grand Am.

The car was in decent shape, so I figured it probably had a blown head gasket, which caused the owner to junk the car. When I pulled the oil pan, I found the infamous chocolate milk.



I didn't see any other issues with the motor, so it's kind of sad that the car was sent to the salvage just because of a blown head gasket. I bought this engine during one of the salvage yard's sales for $115.

I was surprised to discover that it had an 086 head, the same as the HO Quad out of my GTZ. GM put several different heads on Quads, but everything I've read says the 086 is the best mix of strength, power and performance.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 08-01-2017).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #24, 08-01-2017 10:44 PM
      I came across some old threads about deleting the radio antenna. Since I have all the body panels off the car, now is the perfect time to make this modification. I will run the antenna up the A pillar, because I think it makes more sense than setting the antenna horizontally under the fender.

http://www.fiero.nl/forum/A...110502-1-079886.html



I cut a circle out of a piece of seat trim from my old Silverado pickup and used panel cement on both sides of the hole.


I then used filler to smooth it out and it looks great now with primer on it.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 08-01-2017).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #25, 08-01-2017 10:55 PM
      I've been looking for a set of seats in decent condition but haven't had any luck yet. I have three sets now, but they're all different and there aren't two seats in good condition. Then I came across this post from 78_elky about using 4th generation Camaro seats.

 
quote
Originally posted by 78_elky:

So I still have yet to work on the cruise control but I did get some good stuff done on the car.
I robbed the 4th gen Camaro seats from my El Camino and threw them in the car.
I really like the seats but I never liked that they were grey in my El Camino's black interior so this was perfect.
I'm going to pick up another set for the El Camino this weekend (for $40!) and I'll throw some aftermarket black leather skins on them.

I really love them and they work great in the Fiero. I know this has been done before but its still great to me :-D
Jessica


I think her seats look great, plus 4th gen Camaros and Firebirds are very common at my favorite salvage. In fact, I found this set.



These seats are in good shape, but not perfect, so I think I'll wait for a better set. Seats from 4th gen Firebirds will also work, but they have a separate head rest that I don't like.


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #26, 09-19-2017 10:23 PM
      I haven't done much work on the car lately. My wife and I took a trip for a week in early August. Plus, I'm a youth soccer referee so when the fall season starts my weekends get pretty full.

I've bought some more extra parts from an '88 coupe in my favorite salvage, as well as some more bodyworking tools. The weather is supposed to cool off significantly next week so I'll be more likely to get back to work.


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #27, 10-10-2017 09:33 PM
      Today I stumbled across the photos I took when I first laid eyes on my Fiero. It was January 1st, 2011. My brother and I had taken our two sons to Fayetteville, Arkansas to see the car. It was pretty tired but it was all there and it was a 5-speed car.







The woman on the left side of the photo is the original owner. She still loved the car and was happy to know it was going to someone who'd love it, too.






I'm thrilled to see the pictures of the car, but they bring back the grief over the loss of my brother.

I'd forgotten what a redneck experience it was to find the car.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 06-27-2018).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #28, 10-18-2017 01:59 PM
      I've been busy with work and soccer, so I haven't had much time to work on the car. When I do get an hour here or there to get over to the shop, I sand body parts. I saved the two most challenging pieces for last: the front and rear fascias.

They have such weird shapes, sanding them was difficult until I came up with a jig. I found the legs of a desk in a dumpster at my local high school. Some 2x4s screwed to it make a decent platform to hold the fascias at waist level while I sand.

When I first removed the stock front fascia years ago, I noticed it had a serious sag problem in the center. Part of this was caused by the fact that the car was missing the metal bracket that runs from the space frame down to the center of the fascia. I bought three other fascias looking for a good one, but they all have issues. I then took a closer look at the stock one and decided I could fix the sag.

These photos show a piece of wood clamped to the back side of the sag. I'm thinking I could fiberglass a piece of aluminum plate where the wood is, extending it to the sides for a few inches.





Anyone have a different way to solve this problem?



Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #29, 11-22-2017 05:23 PM
      Not much progress to report. I tried to using fiberglass to fix the sag in the front fascia but I mixed it wrong and it never hardened. I'll try again. I've also been sanding and wet sanding body parts to get them ready for paint. I have a lot of time off in December so I'm hoping to make major progress on all fronts.

I replaced the tang that holds the center bracket for the front fascia. I wish I would've taken photos of the salvage yard car to get a better idea of where it needed to be.




Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #30, 11-25-2017 08:50 AM
      My favorite salvage yard is having a 40-percent off sale this weekend, so I spent yesterday afternoon there. I scored these seats out of a '99 Camaro for $15 a piece. The upholstery is in great shape, but I found a problem with the driver's seat.



One of the springs is missing and parts are broken.



Another trip to the salvage is in order, but I haven't decided yet whether to just get the parts to fix this seat, or exchange the seats. Yesterday I saw a nice set in a '99 Cavalier so I'll look them over carefully and decide then.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 11-25-2017).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #31, 11-25-2017 09:47 AM
      Over the years I've collected two other sets of Fiero seats, but I don't have two matching seats that are in good shape. In the process I learned the Fiero came with many different types:

http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/095141.html



Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #32, 11-26-2017 05:46 PM
      I went back to the salvage and got the Cavalier seats. I'm not going to use them.

Cavalier seat on the left, Fiero seat on the right:



As you can see, the bottom of the Cavalier seat is shorter and wider than the Fiero. While moving both seats around, the Fiero seat just feels more substantial. The Cavalier seats feel downright flimsy by comparison.

Changing over the brackets is easy:





Direct bolt-in.

The Cavalier seat looks good in the car, even though the bottom is wider than the stock seat.



Pro tip: remove the Cavalier's seat belt guide BEFORE you put the seat in the car. I didn't, and when I sat down in the seat and moved it all the way back, that stupid guide broke the fuel filler door lever.



After all that, I've decided I'll use the Camaro seats instead. I'll take the Cavalier seats back to the salvage tomorrow. I've already taken the covers off the Camaro seats and washed them and tomorrow I'll just get a bottom from another Camaro to replace the damaged one.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 11-26-2017).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #33, 01-14-2018 06:45 PM
      Here's a photo of the Camaro seats installed in the car. I think they look great and may just keep these covers instead of trying to find the gray/dark gray version. The only downside is that they look so good they make my original carpets look pretty worn. Once I get the car on the road I may spring for new black carpets.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 01-17-2018).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #34, 01-14-2018 07:06 PM
      Since I have all the body panels off the car, I decided now is a good time to convert the manual windows to power. Five or six years ago I bought a pair of power-everything doors from a salvage-yard '86 GT. Nice to finally get them out and take them apart.

I'm amazed at how many doodads and gadgets there are in these doors.



The insides of this door are pretty clean compared to the doors on my '87. Makes me wonder if the salvage yard car was stored for quite a while before being junked.

I eventually removed the glass from my driver's side door so I could get the guides out, and to be able to clean everything. I figured if it's taken seven years to get to this point, I might as well take a little extra time to fix and clean things that need it.

My guides were in bad shape, but I didn't want to buy new ones, so today I went to Walmart to try to find suitable material to replace the felt. The term "industrial strength" on the box caught my eye. It was about $8.



I just peeled the old stuff off, then wire brushed the metal.


The new stuff goes right on.


I was planning to use the same stuff for my DIY dew wipes, until I encountered a problem. The original wipes are in horrible condition.



The worst parts are the little rubber inserts. What do you all use to replace these parts?



I'll search the archive, but if anyone has any guidance about how to replace these rubber parts, please speak up.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 01-14-2018).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #35, 01-14-2018 07:20 PM
      I had a week's vacation over Christmas, so my son and I made the 3-hour drive to Wichita to look at a couple Fieros in a salvage yard up there. On the way we stopped in Winfield, Kansas which is home to a guy who owns all kinds of exotic cars. He keeps them in an old storefront right on the main drag, and periodically trades them out.

Last time we were there, which was a couple years ago, it was full of Pontiac muscle: an early 70s TA, a couple '69 GTOs including a Judge, etc. This time there was something just as cool:



It looked brand new, like it had just come from the dealer.


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #36, 01-27-2018 10:55 PM
      Spent most of the day working on the car today. I wet sanded several body panels, but also started working on my DIY dew wipes. I used the tips in this thread to order the parts:

http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/129107.html

A couple years passed before I removed my old dew wipes and I was surprised at how worn out they were, so then I figured I'd just order all new wipes. After a couple of days I changed my mind again (a common theme in this project), and decided to go ahead and use the parts I'd already bought to make my own. Velcro works great for the felt material, and it has adhesive on one side, making installation simple.

The one part I'm struggling with is the small guides. The felt is so stiff it crumbles off but the rubber underneath has turned to stone and will not come off the bracket.



At first I considered using vacuum hose to replace the rubber, but then found some weatherstripping at Home Depot that's shaped exactly the same, flat on one side and rounded on the other. It even has adhesive.

I may try burning the old stuff off.

I hope to finish painting and installing all the body panels in the next few weeks. I know that that will give me a huge emotional boost and help inspire me to finish.



Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #37, 02-03-2018 10:12 PM
      I was cleaning out my computer yesterday and I found hundreds of photos I thought were lost. As I've mentioned, I accidentally deleted all the photos on my phone a few years ago, including most of the ones I took of my Fiero project. I must have saved them to my computer and forgotten all about it. Oh well.

Here's the first batch. They show how I set a Quad on the Fiero engine cradle to figure out how to mount it.

This Quad is out of a Grand Am, but I don't remember which one. If you're going to mate a Quad to a Fiero cradle, I highly recommend using a welding table. This table was a gift from my brother and it made the process much easier.



As you can see, the exhaust hump is very close to the AC compressor on the Quad, so most people cut it out and weld in a straight piece. I showed that process earlier in this thread.



I used a level on the Quad's cam towers to make sure the engine was sitting level from side to side. It took some jockeying, but there's a sweet spot where both ends clear the cradle yet the top of the engine fits under the deck lid with NO modifications. It's difficult to describe but it does exist.



I used pieces of wood of varying thicknesses to get the engine level. It's been 7 years since I did this, but I think the bottom of the oil pan does not sit level, it's angled, with the drain plug at the bottom of the incline. The Quad is such a weird looking engine, I figured it made sense to have it sitting crooked in this way.



In previewing this post, I realized the cradle pictured in these photos is an '88 that I bought at the salvage. At some point I decided not to switch to the '88, because of all the other modifications it would require. It's obviously different from my '87, but the process is still similar.


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #38, 02-03-2018 10:19 PM
      A quick note about one of the odd features of the Quad 4. They came from the factory with a coolant line that runs from the thermostat housing to the throttle body and then back to the head. The system was probably designed to warm the throttle body in cold climates, but it's not needed. It's common to remove the lines and plug the coolant fittings on the t-stat housing and head, and just leave the openings on the throttle body.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 03-11-2018).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #39, 02-03-2018 10:36 PM
      After wrestling the engine for a while, I finally decided to roll it out of the garage and power wash it.



Here are a couple more photos showing how I used wood blocks to get the engine where I wanted before working on the mounts.



I don't remember what I measuring for, but here it is for posterity.





Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #40, 02-03-2018 10:54 PM
      I found the whole series of photos I took when I modified the Fiero's transaxle mounts to fit the Quad's Getrag. I could've fabbed new mounts, as I've seen some other guys do, but I knew using the Fiero mounts as a starting point would be faster.

The Fiero's front transaxle mount won't fit around the Getrag's housing.



I used a piece of cardboard to make a pattern, then cut the Fiero mount.



After cutting down the Fiero mount and attaching it to the Getrag, I decided what was left was too flimsy. You can see why.



Somewhere I have a photo of the angle iron I used, instead. Maybe I already posted it here. I'm too tired to check.

The rear mount would almost fit, but the holes were just a little off. I cut one side and welded in a small piece of angle iron to move the bolt hole about a half an inch toward the transaxle. I welded a spacer onto the other hole so it would fit tightly to the case.



I did all this work this way just to get the engine and transaxle mounted securely enough to put the cradle in the car to make sure everything fit without needing to modify the deck lid. It worked.

My plan has always been to pull the cradle out and go over these mounts again, either beefing up and beautifying what I've already done, or starting over to make something better.


Wraith177 MSG #41, 02-04-2018 11:20 AM
      Keep up the good work man! I know what you mean about changing your mind, I’ve changes mine I don’t know how many times on what options to get on mine... money being the biggest factor. Look forward to seeing more.



Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #42, 02-13-2018 02:09 PM
      Finally finished my DIY outer dew wipes. I replaced all the felt pieces with Velcro material. I also replaced the rubber parts of the inserts with new weather stripping from Home Depot.



If you ever decide to do this, I recommend using some kind of hole punch to make the holes. Using a drill was imprecise and I'm worried about how much trouble I'll have installing these on the doors.



Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #43, 03-05-2018 02:09 PM
      Weekend update. I installed the power equipment into the driver's side door. I underestimated how much time would be required to clean the inside of the door, the window glass, etc.

Bolting the power regulator to the door turned out to be a PITA. I had to grind down one of the bolts to get it to fit between the motor housing and the door. I didn't take a picture of the problem area because I was frustrated, but after wrestling with it for 20 minutes I got it installed.



As I told my wife, it's a little thing, but being able to actually install something instead of taking something off the car is a huge lift.


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #44, 03-05-2018 02:21 PM
      Here are couple more random photos I'd thought were lost.

The first is what the driver's side floor pan looked like when I first pulled the carpet out. The car had very little rust, except for this.

I think the original owner must've spilled a coke down the console, because the bottom of the car looks great and there aren't any holes.



Next up is a photo of my GTZ's bottom engine mount. As I've mentioned before, I'd considered using the Grand Am style mounts, with one in front and one on the back of the engine, because that seemed to be the most common type. On the other hand, the GTZ style is very similar to the Iron Duke's mounting system and it doesn't clutter up the engine bay. I cut the flange off the GTZ bracket and I think I had to drill one hole to mate it to the Fiero engine mount.




Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #45, 03-10-2018 10:44 PM
      Not much progress to report, but I did find some more photos of the beginning of the project.

Here are photos of my Quad right after I removed it from my GTZ rust bucket. To review, my brother gave me the GTZ in 2008 with a blown head gasket. I put a new head on it and cleaned up the engine, then drove it every day for four years. I put more than 100,000 relatively trouble-free miles on it. As you can see, the engine was filthy.





The big pulley is for the power steering pump, which I'm obviously not using in my Fiero. Quad 4 power steering pulleys are notorious for being difficult to remove.





Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #46, 03-10-2018 10:53 PM
      I bought an '88 cradle and suspension, but then decided to use my '87 because I didn't want to delay the swap with an extra project. I may switch to the '88 cradle at some point, but for now I decided to alter the '87. That meant shortening the tie rods, as I've previously mentioned, and also converting to solid mounts.

At the time, my nephew was working in a machine shop in California and he offered to turn me a couple front bushings out of aluminum.



It was a struggle to get the rubber out of the sleeves. I ended up burning it out.



The rear mounts were easier. I had some heavy-walled oilfield pipe lying around which I cut to length then welded on. I will probably grind about a 1/4 inch off of them because I think they're too tall.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 03-10-2018).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #47, 03-10-2018 10:59 PM
      When I bought the car, the right front headlight was propped up with a piece of firewood. I disassembled the motors and found the "sand" inside. After reading everything I could find on this forum about replacing the plastic dowels, and playing around with the gears, I decided there was no reason I couldn't use sections of rubber fuel hose.



I figure the only reason the engineers used plastic dowels in the drive mechanism was to absorb shock. I put the motors back together and tested them and they worked fine. So come at me if you disagree.


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #48, 05-23-2018 12:44 PM
      Not much progress to report. As I mentioned, I'm a board member and referee for my local youth soccer club so my weekends are pretty full in the spring and fall.

-planning to re-do my DIY dew wipes with different rivets. The pop rivets protrude too far and keep the wipes from sealing tightly to the door. I finally found tinner's rivets at an Ace hardware store but haven't had time to change them out

-planning to do major painting this weekend. I'm using Rust-oleum and a spray gun. I'll post photos.

-got myself a birthday present from eBay and it just arrived.



I've just been thumbing through it and already answered several questions I've had about reassembling my car. Should've bought one of these years ago.


Dennis LaGrua (dlagrua@comcast.net) MSG #49, 05-23-2018 07:40 PM
      Lots of good work here and your mechanical prowess seems excellent. Very interesting and informative thread. I hope that the end result meets your expectations.



Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #50, 05-24-2018 01:13 PM
     
 
quote
Originally posted by Dennis LaGrua:

Lots of good work here and your mechanical prowess seems excellent. Very interesting and informative thread. I hope that the end result meets your expectations.



Thank you for the kind words. While my plans have changed multiple times, my goal for the project has not. I want to drive a cool car that I restored/customized myself and honor my brother in the process.


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #51, 05-26-2018 09:52 AM
     
 
quote
Originally posted by Quad Raider:





I’m a little disappointed that this manual doesn’t have any information about the formula-type body parts. I know I’ve seen pages with that info posted on this forum. Were they from an ‘88 manual?


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #52, 05-29-2018 12:00 PM
      Thanks to the holiday weekend, I had some time to work on the car. I was working on painting all the body panels before reinstalling them, but they were taking up so much space I decided to put them back on the car and then paint them all at once. As usual, I underestimated how much time and effort it would take to reinstall them (you'd think I'd know by now).

I got the roof panels reinstalled, which feels like a major accomplishment.







Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #53, 05-29-2018 12:10 PM
      So many reasons why reassembling the car is taking so long. For one, I have probably twice as many spare nuts, bolts and other fasteners than I do actual parts that came from my car. This is because any time I find a Fiero in the salvage, I always grab whatever I can, especially if I remove a part from it. I was careful to label every bag of parts, whether from my car or a salvage yard one, but now the shop is full of baggies with Fiero parts. So yesterday I spent 45 minutes putting all the spare fasteners into one box.

I've posted before that I accidentally deleted all the photos on my phone a couple years ago. They included all the pics I took of the disassembly process. So, while I have all the fasteners, not having the photos of where they came from really slows me down. When I found the metal clips that attach to the rear clip, I spent 10 minutes trying to figure out how they're oriented. Then I remembered that DKcustoms helped me out three years ago (THREE YEARS!):

 
quote
Originally posted by DKcustoms:

I didn't forget! Just got busy.

There are metal clips, both on the rear clip and taillights that are important for holding in the taillight screws.




Hope that helps


For the record, the correct way to install them is on the left:





Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #54, 05-29-2018 12:24 PM
      Both of my OE taillight lenses were cracked and broken. I bought a good replacement unit for the right one at the salvage years ago, but got just the lense for the left one. I've forgotten why I didn't get the whole unit for that side, but whatever the reason it meant I had to disassemble the stock one to replace the lense.



The plastic was brittle, but I got it apart without damaging anything. Of course, once I got it apart I found some of the reflective paint was worn off.



I checked the forum and saw that some folks repaint the reflectors, but others use foil tape because it resists heat.




A couple of notes if you go this route. One, the stuff is very sticky. It took me a few minutes to get the hang of using it. Second, there's no way to avoid wrinkles. At first I was disgusted by them, but then realized they don't matter. The idea is to reflect the light, and wrinkled tape will do that better than smooth plastic that's lost its shiny paint.

I pulled the butyl sealant out of the gap and replaced it with this 3M rope caulk. The stuff was less than $3 and was very easy to work with. I figured 35 feet would be plenty.



I used two strands of it, though thinking back on it now I realize I probably should have smushed the two together.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 06-18-2018).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #55, 06-04-2018 02:27 PM
      More progress to report. I'm working on getting all the body panels back on the car. Over the weekend I focused on the front fascia. The reinstallation process in general is taking much longer than I expected, for various reasons. In the case of the front fascia, there were a couple of problems. Years ago I removed the radiator and condenser to straighten and paint the mounting bracket.



I reinstalled the bracket and radiator soon after the work was done, but for some reason I didn't immediately reinstall the condenser and it'd been sitting in the trunk all this time. This weekend I struggled to get it to fit, then realized one of the mounting brackets had been installed backwards. I think the car took a pretty good hit in the front end in its previous life and whoever did the work took some liberties putting it back together.

The other problem I rediscovered was that the flexible air duct material was ripped and the part that attaches to the fascia on the passenger side was missing.



I had some old rubber floor tiles lying around so I cut a piece to fit and used rivets to attach it to the plastic.



This is before I did the final trimming.


I have so much more work to do, but getting the front fascia completely reinstalled was a huge emotional lift. As my brother said, it's starting to look like a car again.



I also got the right quarter panel reinstalled.

Next up:
-left quarter
-finish reinstallation of the rear fascia
-re-do the outer dew wipes
-finish converting doors to power windows/locks
-reinstall door skins
-finish masking the car
-spray the car

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 06-06-2018).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #56, 06-04-2018 02:32 PM
      Another problem. I need two of the four grommets that mount the condenser. Anyone know where to get them?



Patrick (mnofony@yahoo.com) MSG #57, 06-04-2018 03:00 PM
     
 
quote
Originally posted by Quad Raider:

I’m a little disappointed that this manual doesn’t have any information about the formula-type body parts. I know I’ve seen pages with that info posted on this forum. Were they from an ‘88 manual?


I'm somewhat confused by this. What type of body parts does the '87 Fiero manual show then... just the GT aero style? Aren't the "formula-type body parts" (from '88) basically just the same as the '87 coupe body parts?

[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 06-04-2018).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #58, 06-04-2018 04:28 PM
     
 
quote
Originally posted by Patrick:

I'm somewhat confused by this. What type of body parts does the '87 Fiero manual show then... just the GT aero style? Aren't the "formula-type body parts" (from '88) basically just the same as the '87 coupe body parts?



It shows bumper pad and the aero style, not the formula/coupe style. Since posting that, I spent some time digging through the archive and remembered that I'd crossed this bridge before. The formula/coupe body style is covered in a separate manual, the P22, which is available here:

http://www.fieronews.net/fu...Fiero_Parts_Book.pdf

Edit: Yes, to be clear, the formulas and coupes are the same body style.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 06-04-2018).]

Patrick (mnofony@yahoo.com) MSG #59, 06-06-2018 02:10 AM
     
 
quote
Originally posted by Quad Raider:

It shows bumper pad and the aero style, not the formula/coupe style... The formula/coupe body style is covered in a separate manual, the P22


Why would the '87 manual show the bumper pad style? If I remember correctly, it was no longer even available after '86.



Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #60, 06-06-2018 01:26 PM
      That's a great question. I'd imagine Pontiac figured that since so much of the car was still the same from '86 to '87, it could keep using the same factory manual and then released the supplement, the P22, some time later, maybe when the '88s came out. If I'm reading it right, it appears my manual was printed in November of 1986.




Patrick (mnofony@yahoo.com) MSG #61, 06-06-2018 03:45 PM
     
 
quote
Originally posted by Quad Raider:

I'd imagine Pontiac figured that since so much of the car was still the same from '86 to '87, it could keep using the same factory manual...


The 4-banger duke changed a lot in '87 (different ignition, intake, etc). Which version of the duke do they have in the '87 manual... or did the newer version of the duke need to be covered in the supplement as well? Seems like a strange way to print up manuals!


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #62, 06-08-2018 08:45 AM
     
 
quote
Originally posted by Patrick:

The 4-banger duke changed a lot in '87 (different ignition, intake, etc). Which version of the duke do they have in the '87 manual... or did the newer version of the duke need to be covered in the supplement as well? Seems like a strange way to print up manuals!


Yes, the P22 supplement covers the 1987 duke and the V6, too. As confusing as it may be, it makes sense for GM to print manuals that way. There really weren’t that many changes to the car from 1986 to 1987, so printing a supplemental manual that covered the differences would be cheaper.


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #63, 06-13-2018 08:12 AM
      Reassembly continues. I installed the rear fascia and the left quarter panel and started working on the doors. When I installed my homemade outer dew wipe on the driver's side door I noticed it wasn't fitting flush against the door frame, but I had put the window back in and added the power window/lock/mirror equipment and wiring, so I was reluctant to take it all apart again.

I used pop rivets the first time which stick out too far. I found some specialized rivets at the hardware store, but wasn't sure which size to get.



These rivets are hollow on one end, so you use a punch to flatten them down. Because these were a little too long, I made a hash of it.



Instead of replacing all the pop rivets, I decided to use the trusty Dremel to grind them down.



Then, instead of using the OE screws to install the wipes to the door, I used new, bigger flat head screws. Both dew wipes now sit flush on the door frames. I reinstalled the glass for the driver's side door and am set to convert the passenger side door to power window/lock/mirror.

Next up will be reinstalling the door skins, final sanding of the whole car then spraying paint.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 06-13-2018).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #64, 06-13-2018 08:16 AM
      I had a few minutes to make new gaskets for the wing. I don't know where this sheet of rubber came from, but it was the perfect thickness. With the old gaskets as a pattern, I used scissors to cut out the new ones then the bench grinder to smooth and bevel the edges. Worked great.







My OE gaskets would still work, but the material has become very hard over the years.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 06-13-2018).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #65, 06-15-2018 04:31 PM
      I installed my DIY dew wipe on the passenger door and decided to take some photos of the process. The wipes fit flush against the door frame now. The wipe is a little bowed in this photo, but once the window is installed it will push the wipe up against the metal.



I ground down the pop rivets, instead of drilling them out and using tinner's rivets to replace them. Tinner's rivets are the way to go, if you can find the right size. They're hollow on one end. The perfect size for this job would involve a rivet where the solid part ends inside the hole.

These rivets were a little too long.



I also ditched the original screws and went with these, since they have a bigger head.





I was hesitant to use bigger screws because I worried they'd interfere with the door skins. No problem, the engineers put these little cutouts in the door skin to fit over the screws.






Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #66, 06-15-2018 04:42 PM
      I used bolts and nylock nuts to attach the power regulator to the door. As I learned on the driver side door, one of the bolts has to be ground down to fit behind the motor casing.



I took about an 8th of an inch off of it.



Still took some finagling but it fit.



The process is much easier with the door skin removed.




Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #67, 06-15-2018 04:52 PM
      I installed the wiring harness for the door. I then spent 20 minutes fishing the two inner window felts out of that little pocket at the top of the door. What a pain.

I've misplaced one of the two plastic window stops so I'll have to remove one from one of my donor doors. After that will come installing the power lock mechanism and the braces, but I'll have to make a run to the hardware store because I ran out of nuts and bolts.

Once all that's done I can reinstall the door skins. Then I'll be ready to do one final wet sand of the car, mask and paint.

After that, I think I'll switch to the interior. I need to pull the dash, to run the wiring for the power equipment in the doors, but also to build a drink holder/glove compartment where the map pocket used to be. I also need to re-cover the headliner.



Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #68, 06-18-2018 05:34 PM
      Two setbacks to report, as I attempt to reassemble the body to prepare for paint. Both involve the doors.

As I was attaching the bracket that holds the power lock actuator, I remembered that I had to enlarge the mounting holes to accept the bolts. As I drilled out the holes, the bit caught the rubber boot and shredded it. Now the boot looks like Dumbledore's hat.



I'll try to find a replacement at the salvage.

After that minor fiasco, I started cleaning up my door handles and the spring on the driver's side door broke.



I made a replacement spring out of a lawn mower spring.



Everything was fine until I tried bending the tabs back into place over the replacement spring and they broke off. So that means using the handle from my salvage yard door. Because it's off an '86, it has the grooved molding, which for the door handle means a strip of flexible plastic glued to the middle of it. I pried it off but in the process decided the handle needs to be repainted.



I checked the other door handle and discovered it also had the same plastic strip glued to it.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 06-19-2018).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #69, 06-25-2018 02:27 PM
      Had a little time over the weekend to reassemble more parts. While preparing to put the hood back on, I noticed that the broken headlight frame I'd repaired years ago was cracked again. This was one of the first repairs I ever made on the car.



I don't have the capability to weld aluminum, so I did the next best thing, I used JB Weld. After I rebuilt the headlight motors and made this repair, I tested the headlights about 10 times before moving onto more serious issues. The epoxy must have cracked during that testing.



Luckily, I grabbed the headlight assemblies from an '88 in the salvage last summer so I changed out the motors and installed the left side.





I have so much of the car disassembled I don't have an easy way to test the lights again.




Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #70, 06-25-2018 02:35 PM
      Here are some photos of the strips on the door handles I mentioned before. My car has smooth molding so the door handles should be plain. When I removed the passenger side handle I was surprised to find a plastic strip on it. It's similar to but narrower than the strips on my salvage yard doors, which came from an '86 GT.

This picture shows my OE driver's side handle, with the two strips removed from the other handles.




I got the door skins reinstalled, but I'm not happy about how they fit, so I'll be working on them more this week.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 06-25-2018).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #71, 07-02-2018 05:14 PM
      Quick update. I'm in a holding pattern because I can't get my homemade outer dew wipes to fit correctly. The outer edge of the dew wipe is supposed to fit over the top edge of the door. I must've drilled the mounting holes in the wrong location, because my wipes are too low.



I used the old wipes as patterns, so I have no idea how I messed this up. I figure my options are either biting the bullet and buying new wipes from The Fiero Store or drilling new holes in the door, unless someone knows a secret I'm missing.

While dealing with this process, I learned the small section of body trim has to be applied to the door skin BEFORE the skin is installed.



I searched all over the shop for that section, including my big Fiero parts bins and extra boxes. I finally found it, in the plastic container I used for all of the parts of the door when I originally took them apart last summer. I was so disgusted with the whole process I just left.

Summer has arrived in Oklahoma in all its humid grossness: Temps in the 90s with dew points of infinity. That means pretty much any excuse to stop working and go home to the AC is a good one.


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #72, 07-04-2018 09:47 PM
      I spent a couple hours in the shop today trying to get the passenger side dew wipe to fit up over the door skin. I carefully checked it with the OE wipe and confirmed that I drilled the holes 1/16 to 1/8 of an inch too high. I also noticed that the OE wipe is cupped along the length, with the concave part facing the door skin.

My plan is to buy new raw material and an industrial hole punch and start over.


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #73, 07-04-2018 09:54 PM
      Also today, met another Fiero family. My wife and son and I were out for a drive when I took the scenic route home from Collinsville, which is about eight miles from home. We were surprised to see a silver Fiero sitting in the driveway of a very nice home. I stopped to take a photo and we saw the homeowner mowing the lawn, so my family urged me to get out and say hi.

We spoke to the gentleman for about 20 minutes. The silver Fiero is an ‘88 coupe. He also had a black ‘88 in the garage. He had bought the black one for his 16-year-old son and discovered it has more issues than the seller admitted to. He bought the silver one because it was drivable and he got a good deal on it. He got into Fieros specifically because his son wanted one. How cool is that?


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #74, 07-17-2018 09:37 AM
      Haven't done much to the car recently for a variety of reasons. I'm trying to source dew wipe material locally but haven't had time to do a thorough search. In the meantime I can demonstrate how I fixed the sag in my front fascia. I tried using a piece of aluminum but it seemed too heavy so I worried it would cause more problems than it solved. I ended up using a ceiling fan blade and riveted it to the fascia. The fascia still had some sticky fiberglass resin on the back side from where I tried to attach the aluminum plate.



I will probably use a Dremel to trim the stiffener back even more, but no one but me will ever know it's there.



I learned during this process that the fascia can never be, and probably wasn't meant to be, perfectly flat everywhere. But this fix was easy and I'm satisfied with the result. It looks so much better than it did when I got the car home.



The Pontiac emblem in the photo is just resting there. I pulled it off the trunk of a G6 in the salvage yard on a brutally hot day last week. I've seen other forum members use one but wasn't sure if I liked the look. I do.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 07-17-2018).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #75, 08-07-2018 09:21 AM
      Work on the car has been at a standstill for a variety of reasons, one of which is my annual early August vacation. Something Fiero-related happened on the trip and I posted it in a separate thread:

 
quote
Originally posted by Quad Raider:

"Fiero guy?" the security guard asked me. The question surprised me so much all I could say was, "What?"

"Fiero guy?" he asked again. I just started laughing and finally said, "Is it that obvious?" He smiled then said, "You're not the first."

My wife and I had made a detour to the Detroit area on our yearly trip from Oologah, Oklahoma to visit my sister in southeast Pennsylvania. On the afternoon of Saturday, August 4th, 2018, I parked our rental car in that little side driveway outside the old Fiero factory at 900 Baldwin Avenue in Pontiac and got out to take pictures of the sign.

After a few minutes I moved the car to the north end of the building and was snapping more photos when the security guard finally walked up to me. I told him I'd bought my Fiero in January of 2011 but still hadn't gotten it on the road. "You will," he said. I laughed again and thanked him.

I took some more photos then got back in the car and headed south on Baldwin to resume the trip. About a hundred yards south of the factory a red GT in excellent condition passed us headed north. My wife and I started laughing at the serendipity.













Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #76, 08-27-2018 05:49 PM
      I'm slowly getting back into the groove. Still planning to make a new set of outer dew wipes, but haven't gotten around to ordering the raw material. In the meantime there's always more sanding to do on body panels.

The last part to be primed and sanded is the wing. I didn't realize how big the wing is until I tried to sand and prime it. I came up with this mount to hold it. Anyone else have a better idea?





We're back to our usual August weather in Oklahoma, which means highs in the mid 90s and high humidity, and that makes it even tougher to get over to the shop to work. Here's to cooler, drier weather in the next couple of weeks. Of course, the arrival of fall means I'll be busy refereeing soccer again.




Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #77, 11-19-2018 10:07 PM
      After almost three months, I'm back to work on the car, sort of. I'm on vacation this week so I have some time, but I picked up another project that I need to finish. My best friend's 2005 Ford F-150 needs new timing gears. He already bought a replacement truck so when I get this one fixed he'll sell it and share some of the money with me.

I ordered another set of dew wipe material and bought an industrial hole punch.



I'm a little nervous about punching the holes because I don't want to screw these up again. On the other hand, while moving the passenger side door skin around I got it to fit tighter to and lower on the door.

A couple of weeks ago when I had a few spare minutes, I tried to use the ratchet strap method to adjust the deck lid torsion springs. I'm adding a wing to my car, so I was browsing the forum one day and came across the instructions:

http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum9/HTML/000041.html

Looked easy, so I gave it a shot. Somehow I managed to pull one of the springs completely loose.




The spring is supposed to fit inside that C-shaped flange.


Here's the other spring still nestled in its flange.


Classic example of me turning a simple task into a lot of extra work for myself. Glad I have a shop manual now.


Habanera Hal (halspalter1@aol.com) MSG #78, 11-20-2018 02:05 PM
      After reading through this whole thread, I could only thing I could think of was your name must be Murphy. I know I wouldn't have your patience to see this through. I admire your perseverance!

When you finally get your DIY dew wipes finished, would you consider posting a how-to thread with resources and all?


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #79, 11-22-2018 12:25 PM
      I redid my passenger side dew wipe and I'm still not happy with the results. The wipe sits up high enough for the rubber flange to fit over the top of the door, but there's still a gap. It appears tightening the screws is bending the wipe and forcing the rubber flange inboard so that it doesn't seal.



It was a very laborious process taking apart the first DIY dew wipe and getting the inserts and felts ready to be used for the second go-round. Buying the hole puncher was a good move, but it took me a few tries to get the hang of it.



The key to using it is being very careful when positioning it on the material. I used its guide on the OE wipe to get the placement of the holes.

I also used two sizes of rivets. Ace Hardware calls them tubular rivets. The smaller size is 1/8" by 1/4", the larger one is 3/16" by 1/4". The smaller size is for the mirror flange and the felts, the larger size is for the inserts.



I used a chunk of plate in a vise as a backer and a punch to start spreading the end of each rivet. I flipped the punch over to finish flattening them. (This photo shows pop rivets in the mirror flange, but I removed them and used tubular rivets instead.



I thought I had posted a link to the thread where I learned about making my own wipes. Here's the link in case I didn't:

http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/129107.html

I ordered the raw material from Convertible Top Specialists in Florida.

http://www.topsdown.com/
Part # WEAWW408
$40 for two four-foot sections

I may take the wipe off again and put some thin washers between it and the door to see if that helps. If it doesn't I'll buy new ones from the Fiero Store. For now I'm moving on to other tasks.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 11-22-2018).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #80, 11-22-2018 12:39 PM
      I spent some time in the salvage yard this week looking for parts for my wife's Grand Prix. I noticed a couple 90s model Firebirds with these non-functional hood-mounted heat extractors. Has anyone ever used these on a Fiero?





Since they're plastic it would be easy to cut an opening into them and glass them into/onto the hood. The yard charged me only $8 for both and there's another set if I need it.

My Quad tended to run hot when it was still in my GTZ so I'm concerned about keeping it cool in the Fiero. I've looked at a lot of different hood and decklid vents and only seen a couple I like.

I think these would be perfect if the edges were more parallet, like this:



I'm no expert at fiberglass or body work so this would be a massive amount of work. It's tempting to follow this tangent now as I prep the car for paint, but there's also a good argument for painting the car, finishing the other tasks and getting it on the road, then going back and doing tweaks.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 11-22-2018).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #81, 11-22-2018 12:43 PM
     
 
quote
Originally posted by Habanera Hal:

After reading through this whole thread, I could only thing I could think of was your name must be Murphy. I know I wouldn't have your patience to see this through. I admire your perseverance!

When you finally get your DIY dew wipes finished, would you consider posting a how-to thread with resources and all?


weloveour86se covered it already. I linked to the thread in another post this morning. The things you'll need are the dew wipe material, rivets, some cheap weather stripping from Lowe's (for the inserts) and some heavy duty velcro. As I also mentioned, an industrial hole punch is also a tremendous help.


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #82, 11-24-2018 08:40 AM
      The answer is yes, someone had already tried them. Gokart used them, but he didn’t stop there. He also tried the functional heat extractors from a 2002 GTP. My wife drives one and I’ve always wondered what those extractors would look like on a Fiero.

http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/093383.html

 
quote
Originally posted by Quad Raider:

I spent some time in the salvage yard this week looking for parts for my wife's Grand Prix. I noticed a couple 90s model Firebirds with these non-functional hood-mounted heat extractors. Has anyone ever used these on a Fiero?





Since they're plastic it would be easy to cut an opening into them and glass them into/onto the hood. The yard charged me only $8 for both and there's another set if I need it.

My Quad tended to run hot when it was still in my GTZ so I'm concerned about keeping it cool in the Fiero. I've looked at a lot of different hood and decklid vents and only seen a couple I like.

I think these would be perfect if the edges were more parallet, like this:



I'm no expert at fiberglass or body work so this would be a massive amount of work. It's tempting to follow this tangent now as I prep the car for paint, but there's also a good argument for painting the car, finishing the other tasks and getting it on the road, then going back and doing tweaks.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 12-16-2018).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #83, 11-25-2018 10:35 PM
      I started another thread about the possibility of using dew wipes from a fourth generation Firebird/Camaro:

http://www.fiero.nl/forum/F.../HTML/098612.html#p0


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #84, 12-29-2018 08:41 PM
      I finished installing the 4th-generation Camaro/Firebird dew wipes and I'm very happy with the results:





I eventually trimmed the front of the dew wipe so it would fit around the plastic triangle at the front of the door.



Now on to painting the car.


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #85, 12-29-2018 09:07 PM
      I was on vacation this week so I got a lot of work done, including the first coat of paint. I'm using Rust-oleum sail blue out of quart cans. I always planned to paint the car some shade of blue, even before I decided to use Rust-oleum instead of automotive paint. Once I decided to go with RO, I picked sail blue because it was available in both rattle cans and quart cans pretty much anywhere I looked. For some reason over the last several years quart cans of it have become rare.

I had one full can and half of another (from that time I tried using a roller), so I figured I had plenty for such a small car. More on that coming up. After sanding the car one more time, wiping it down with acetone and then wiping it again with tack cloths, I set up a homemade paint booth.



Now, before we go any further, here's a note about my expectations. I EXPECTED the first coat to look rough. I expect my second and third coats to look better, but not anywhere close to professional. I expect to get the paint job to look good enough for my tastes, by color sanding the whole car as many times as necessary and reshooting anything that needs it. In other words, it will look as good as the effort I put into it.

So on Thursday, I got everything ready, mixed up my first batch of paint and acetone and started spraying. I immediately realized I hadn't used enough acetone because the paint came out too thick and led to major orange peel. I started on the driver's side roof then moved to the front of the car, then the passenger side roof, then the rest of the car. You can see the orange peel on the hood.



By the time I got around to the back of the car, I had the mixture just about right and the paint went on very smoothly.



Because I hadn't thinned the first two cups of paint much, I ran out after getting just one coat on the car. I then spent Friday trying to find a couple more quart cans of RO sail blue in the Tulsa area and finally ended up ordering two cans from Amazon. They arrived today. Tomorrow I will begin color sanding the car and fixing some of the other boo-boos. For instance, as you can see in the first photo, I have the wing mounted on a wooden platform to be able to spray both the botton and top. I sprayed it first, then backed into it a couple of times while painting the car, so I'll have to fix those smudges.

Even though I have a huge amount of work to do to finish the paint job, I had so much fun getting to this point I can't wait to get back at it tomorrow. It's such an emotional lift to get the car all one color again and to see how good it can look when the paint goes on properly.



Habanera Hal (halspalter1@aol.com) MSG #86, 12-29-2018 09:43 PM
      I've looked at a number of YouTube vids on painting a car with Rustoleum. I even remember a magazine (Hot Rod?) that did one a few years ago. Yes, it will look as good as the effort you put into it. I applaud you for your creativity, frugality, and perseverance! Look forward to your updates!

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #87, 01-06-2019 07:09 PM
      Here's what it looks like now. I wet sanded the whole car after that first coat because it was so rough. I also did more research on how to mix the paint and acetone and decided to go with a ratio of 8:4:1, eight parts paint to four parts acetone and one part hardener.



I am absolutely thrilled with the results. It's not a professional quality job, but it's good enough for me.



There's a bit of orange peel over about 50% of the car, but I can't make up my mind yet about whether to lightly color sand it, buff it or just leave it. I'm not going to do anything to it until next weekend at the earliest.


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #88, 01-06-2019 07:15 PM
      Conditions were just about perfect yesterday. Relatively dry air, temperature about 65 and no wind, so I opened one of the garage doors during the process. I used a Harbor Freight HVLP gun that I'd bought at a pawn shop over the summer. I don't even remember what I paid for it, but it was cheap.

I probably didn't have my air compressor set properly and that contributed to the orange peel. I also made some rookie mistakes, like brushing the roof with the air hose a couple of times and somehow getting a big drop of water on the hood.

It is such a tremendous sense of accomplishment, all the sanding and experimenting was worth it. I cannot wait to get the trim, mirrors and lights installed, and to paint the black strip on the front and rear fascias.


wftb (danjesso@bmts.com) MSG #89, 01-08-2019 11:35 AM
      Looks really good. I have a rustoleum universal brand spray bomb paint job on my car. I thought I was going to have to redo it last year, but it responded really well to a machine buff using Meguiars Ultimate compound and a good wax job. Lasted all Summer with a nice gloss.

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #90, 01-14-2019 08:28 PM
      I decided to color sand the car. In the process I fixed some of the imperfections in the paint. I also painted the black molding strip on both fascias.

I’m planning to buy a buffer and polishing compound this week and hope to finish up the whole process this weekend. Then I’ll reinstall all the trim. After that, it’s onto removing the dash to refinish it and to install the wiring harness for the power equipment I added to the doors.


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #91, 01-21-2019 01:01 PM
      I went over to the shop Saturday with the idea that I'd color sand one more time with 1500 grit, wash the car then buff it. I ended up sanding the whole car twice, then again on Sunday. In the process I discovered three small places where I burned through the paint.

After fixing the burns, I looked over the whole car again and could tell I've made great progress in removing the orange peel. I think I'll try one more round of sanding to remove all of it, then I'll try buffing.



Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #92, 01-21-2019 08:18 PM
      Here's what the car looks like now.



Taking sandpaper to newly applied paint was really counter-intuitive, but now I've lost track of how many times I've sanded the whole car. It's been at least five. Since I'd never done it before, I didn't know how much pressure to put on the sanding block or even how to tell when I was done. I will sand the car one more time, really concentrating on each small area as I go.

The places I burned through are all edges: the edge of the passenger side front fender, the corner of the drivers side headlight door and the base of the B pillar on the drivers side.

When I finished the first day of color sanding, I stopped at the grocery store on the way home. "Did you kill a Smurf?" the cashier asked me.



I had tried to think of a name for my car for eight years. I think Smurf Murder is perfect. The custom license tag would be SMRFMDR

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 01-21-2019).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #93, 01-21-2019 08:23 PM
      Here's a little project that frugal Fiero owners will like. Instead of spending money on a holder for the spray gun, I made this.

The rotor is from one of the other cars in the family. I bolted a piece of all-thread to it to make a rack to hold parts for painting but didn't use it and it was just sitting around the garage. The plastic part is from the radiator fan mount for my Beretta GTZ.



When I parted out the car to get it ready to go to the recycler, I saved that fan mount because I knew it would be good for something. I cut the other two arms off of it and opened up the center hole and the paint gun fits perfectly.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 01-21-2019).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #94, 01-29-2019 09:11 PM
      This happened Sunday.



That's the piston and fan from my air compressor. It's a Campbell Hausfeld that I bought in 2001. I haven't been able to find replacement parts, probably because it's so old.


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #95, 02-03-2019 08:24 AM
      I'm still considering what to do about my broken air compressor. In the meantime, I've been color-sanding the car. I think I've finally learned how to do it so yesterday I started at the front of the car and focused on sanding until the orange peel was gone. I finished the left half of the front fascia and the left front fender. Probably won't get over to the shop again until tomorrow.

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #96, 02-03-2019 08:38 AM
      I made a trip to the salvage yesterday and something caught my eye. It's this non-functional hood scoop on a 2001 Mercury Cougar.



It was attached to the car with some screws and a couple speed nuts so it was easy to remove and the yard charged me only $8.

It wasn't until I got back to the shop that I realized the overall shape of it looks almost exactly like the Pontiac logo. It also looks good on the hood.





I searched the forum to see if anyone else has ever used one of these and didn't find anything.

I'm considering two options. One would be to cut out the top end out of it (the part that faces the windshield) but keep it otherwise intact, the other would be to cut out the top end of it, then cut out the concave inner section, flip it over and reattach it and sand the whole thing smooth.

One downside is that the hole in the hood would be relatively small because the front of the extractor would be so narrow up there.


Zeb MSG #97, 02-26-2019 04:23 PM
      Nice work, incredible patience.

About that scoop you found. At first I wasn't sure, but you may be onto something.

How would it look as a roof scoop? Might be too long, but if it fits it could lend a McLaren-ish air to the car. Pop it up there, let's see how it looks!


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #98, 02-26-2019 05:22 PM
      Thank you.

It won't fit on my roof since I converted my car to a sunroof. I probably won't get over the to the shop to check it out any further for at least a few days.



Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #99, 02-26-2019 09:43 PM
      Got over to the shop tonight. Here's what the scoop looks like on the roof:



Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #100, 02-26-2019 09:47 PM
      As you can see from the previous picture, I'm still not finished with the paint job. I rattle-canned the scoop and look how good it looks compared to the rest of the car.

I've probably color sanded the whole car at least ten times. The first six or seven times I didn't know what I was doing so they don't really count. Once I got the knack of it, and switched from 1500 to 800 grit paper, I made real progress.

Now I'm trying to learn how to buff the car.



I can still see some faint orange peel, but as you can see I'm not getting the fabulous shine I was hoping for. I don't know if I'm using the wrong compound, the wrong buffing pad or if Rust-oleum just won't buff out.

It's also possible I need to do the car with 1500 and 2,000-grit paper, THEN try buffing. Any advice would be welcome.

Regardless, every time I look at the car two thoughts come to mind: one, I'm so glad it's all one color (and a color of my choosing) -- two, DAMN, what a great looking car.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 02-26-2019).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #101, 02-26-2019 09:54 PM
      I took a break from color sanding and did the brake booster switch over. I had read several threads on here about switching over to the '96 Blazer brake booster, but then read a couple of threads about using any booster from a mid-90s full size GM pickup/SUV. Along the way I spent a couple hours in the salvage yard comparing and contrasting different boosters and realized they're all about the same.

I ended up getting a booster from a mid-90s Silverado. One day while noodling around the internet I came across a thread by Lunatic on another forum, which demonstrates how to eliminate the need for modifying the push rod. You just disassemble both boosters, switch over the push rod and reassemble the bigger one:

http://www.gtfieros.com/php...&hilit=brake+booster

The step by step instructions and photos were great. The only trouble I had was putting the booster back together again. I just could not get the front cover to twist back into position without a lot of pounding with a hammer.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 02-26-2019).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #102, 02-26-2019 10:03 PM
      While contorting myself to get under the dash to reattach the brake push rod, I discovered this:



Looks like the clutch safety switch quit working and the previous owner had someone wire this jumper. I've seen a few threads about leaving it this way, but using the same circuit to install a cutoff switch as a theft prevention device. I may do that eventually.

I also made another discovery. Somehow in the 8+ years I've been working on the car, I'd never checked the fluid level in the clutch reservoir.



As you can see, it's just about empty. This caused a light bulb to go off. Years ago when I pulled up the driver's side carpet I was surprised to see a huge patch of surface rust. I'd assumed the previous owner spilled a soda down the console. But recently I came across a thread about the clutch master cylinder leaking and the fluid running down the firewall and under the carpet.

I mentioned it here:

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Quad Raider:

Here are couple more random photos I'd thought were lost.

The first is what the driver's side floor pan looked like when I first pulled the carpet out. The car had very little rust, except for this.

I think the original owner must've spilled a coke down the console, because the bottom of the car looks great and there aren't any holes.



So now I know the real culprit. I'll set this aside for now because I want to finish the body.


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #103, 02-26-2019 10:06 PM
      Someone on the Fiero Facebook group posted this Hot Rod article about using the Prius electric power steering setup because it has a fail safe mode that kicks in when there's no signal from the computer. That means, other than having to connect power to it, it's a stand-alone installation. Since I've never actually driven a Fiero, including my own, I don't have the proper perspective to decide if I want to try it.

https://www.hotrod.com/arti...yard-prius-delivers/

The article mentions some hot rodders who've use it, but I'd like to see one installed in a Fiero.


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #104, 02-26-2019 10:10 PM
      To-do list:

-finish buffing/sanding body or whatever
-finish installing body trim
-install stainless steel sunroof tracks
-install sunroof weatherstripping
-install chin spoiler and associated hardware
-remove dash
-install power window/mirror/locks wiring harness
-refinish dash, add glove compartment/drink holders
-install dash

-engine/transmission setup


Zeb MSG #105, 02-27-2019 09:26 PM
      Thanks for the photo of the scoop on the roof. Might be just a bit too long to get the effect I was thinking of. But makes me think. ....

But yeah, won't work with a sunroof!


Habanera Hal (halspalter1@aol.com) MSG #106, 02-27-2019 11:12 PM
      I think you are doing a great job. If you've color sanded to 1000 grit or finer, try spraying a catalyzed clear coat onto it.

https://repaintsupply.com/s...lear-coat-p3685.html

That should give you the shine you're looking for.


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #107, 03-01-2019 08:00 PM
     
 
quote
Originally posted by Habanera Hal:

I think you are doing a great job. If you've color sanded to 1000 grit or finer, try spraying a catalyzed clear coat onto it.

https://repaintsupply.com/s...lear-coat-p3685.html

That should give you the shine you're looking for.


Thank you very much.

I think I’ll try sanding it with 1500 grit one more time, then seriously consider clear coating it. At the beginning of this process I was sure I’d be satisfied with a decent paint job, but now I see that it’s so close to a great paint job, I might as well go for it.



Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #108, 03-03-2019 06:16 PM
      I learned some hard lessons this week. Before reinstalling the rear fascia, make sure you've attached the reflectors first. Also, be very gentle with the 30-year-old plastic. Also, don't pound the steel clips flat before installing, they're supposed to be bent slightly to fit over the pins on the reflectors.



I was irritated that I had to remove the fascia to install the relfectors, but I was disgusted when I broke one trying to install the clips. That led to a 30-minute detour which involved getting one of my spare rear fascias out of the attic to remove the reflectors from it. In the process I saw that I'd removed the reflectors from the OE fascia I stored up there, which means they’re sitting somewhere in the shop.

I also learned that you have to install speed nuts on the front fenders and the rear clip in order to reinstall the side marker lights.





In the process, I color sanded the car one more time with a DA sander and a 3,000-grit pad. The car looks amazing, as long as it's wet. I'm leaning toward adding a clear coat.

We had a winter storm this morning which brought 2" of snow and bitter cold temperatures, so I'm in no hurry to get back over to the shop now.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 03-03-2019).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #109, 04-03-2019 10:14 PM
      Work on the Fiero has come to a stand still for a couple of reasons. One, I've decided to clear coat the car but it will have to wait until I can replace or repair my air compressor.

Two, I'm working to finish my best friend's 2005 Ford F150. I changed out the cam phasers, timing chains, guides and tensioners and got it all back together only to find that it runs like crap. I don't know Fords very well, but I will never own one after working on this thing. Bad cam phasers are a common problem, but so is a vacuum leak either at the doodad that controls the 4WD for the front wheels or the brake booster, or both. The fitting for the stupid brake booster vacuum line is on the back of the intake manifold buried under the firewall.



You can't see it, you can't even get your hand back there to feel it. Checking the F150 forums I found that many people buy Harbor Freight borescopes to see back there, so I bought a Chinese one for $11 on Amazon.

I had to download an app for it, but it actually works. It will not work on Apple devices, but luckily I have an Android phone and tablet. The cable is 15 feet long but it's not very stiff so I taped the camera to a piece of wire. The camera has six very bright and very small LEDs around it with an adjustment knob on the plug. It's designed to be plugged into a PC laptop but came with a couple of adapters for smartphones and tablets.


That is the fitting.


I figured I'll find all kinds of uses for this when I'm working on the Fiero and for 11 bucks it has a surprisingly good picture. It will also record video.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 04-03-2019).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #110, 04-13-2019 10:26 AM
      Work on all my projects is on hold, because I did something really stupid last Sunday. I always, ALWAYS chock a vehicle before I get under it. Except on Sunday. I don't have a reason for why I didn't other than simple carelessness. I'm lucky I have only minor injuries. I know I could have been badly hurt or even killed.

As a warning to everyone else, here's what happened. I got under my friend's pickup in order to remove a vacuum fitting on the back of the engine. While I was under there, I knocked the transmission out of park and the truck started to roll down the driveway. I realized what was happening so I grabbed the bottom of the truck and swung my legs under the truck so they wouldn't be run over by the front wheel.

For a moment, I held the truck still, but then it started to roll. It's a 4x4 with a lot of ground clearance, but I knew the cross member and A arm wouldn't clear my fat belly, so I just held on, trying to use my heels to slow the truck down. The truck dragged me off the concrete pad in front of the garage onto the gravel driveway. A few seconds into the ordeal I realized I was growling at the top of my lungs, out of a mixture of adrenaline and rage at being so stupid.

The truck rolled all the way down the hill, just missing my car and our speed boat. It impacted the trailer holding our catamaran, bending parts of it but not damaging the boat. Instead of just holding on until the truck came to a stop, I decided I needed to just let it roll over me. The result is a scrape across my chest and gut, road rash on my lower back and a deep scrape on my left elbow, but that's it. I have some spectacular bruises but they don't hurt. I went to the ER to be checked out and they didn't find any problems.

The truck shredded my t-shirt and the ground scraped a hole in my jeans.



My sister shot video of the trail I left in the gravel. The gouges are from my heels.


I'm almost completely healed up, except for my left elbow, but it will be ok in a few more days.

So how do I feel? Lucky, grateful and stupid. The worst part is knowing I made my family worry thanks to my carelessness.


longjonsilver (longjonsilver34@juno.com) MSG #111, 04-13-2019 11:27 AM
      Glad you made it out alive. Thanks for the reminder to all of us.
jon



Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #112, 05-19-2019 09:56 AM
      Finally rebuilt my air compressor. I bought a two-cylinder replacement pump from Home Depot and then had to fab a new mounting plate.

Since the replacement pump came with no air filters, I had to get creative. I welded a big washer to a short section of threaded pipe, then riveted a cat food can to the washer and used a punch to open up the center hole. The filter material is foam rubber cut from an old seat cushion.



Also had to fab a guard, since the replacement pump is belt driven instead of direct drive like the one it replaced. I don't remember where I got this 1" square steel mesh. I have three or four sheets of it, 2' x 5', and the stuff was perfect for this.



I test fit it and ran the compressor to make sure nothing rubbed.



For the feed line from the pump to the tank, I first tried bending some 3/8" steel brake line, but because the fitting on the tank has some odd-sized threads I had to use a series of adapters so the brake line wouldn't fit. That sent me on a journey to find some hydraulic hose, which finally landed me at a place in Tulsa that makes braided steel line to order while you wait. The braided steel line is great because it can take the heat from the compressor with no problem.

I've since painted the top half of the unit, including the guard, and added two handles that double as a place to coil the hose. Most importantly, it works and it's much quieter than the factory setup was.

I'm now considering building a whole compressor from scratch using an 80-gallon tank. But that's another project for after the Fiero is done.

Next up, I need to try one last time to fix the truck from hell or get it towed, then it's back to finishing the paint on the Fiero.

[This message has been edited by Quad Raider (edited 05-19-2019).]

Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #113, 06-27-2019 09:41 PM
      Just a quick note to say I haven’t had time to work on the car. We had massive flooding in Oklahoma at the end of May, which meant long hours at my job. I did get my air compressor finished and it works great. I also finished working on the truck from Hell.

I bought a gallon of clear coat and am ready to focus on finishing the paint job. I hope to make some progress this weekend.


Tony Kania MSG #114, 06-27-2019 11:37 PM
     
 
quote
Originally posted by Quad Raider:

Work on all my projects is on hold, because I did something really stupid last Sunday...





Holy heck man, glad you came out fairly alive. Just wow!


Dennis LaGrua (dlagrua@comcast.net) MSG #115, 06-28-2019 09:03 AM
     
 
quote
Originally posted by Quad Raider:

Just a quick note to say I haven’t had time to work on the car. We had massive flooding in Oklahoma at the end of May, which meant long hours at my job. I did get my air compressor finished and it works great. I also finished working on the truck from Hell.

I bought a gallon of clear coat and am ready to focus on finishing the paint job. I hope to make some progress this weekend.


Clear coat is applied shortly after the base coat is sprayed while it is still tacky. Applying over dry paint is not recommended and it may flake off within a year or so. As for the engine swap did it start and run OK?



Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #116, 06-29-2019 09:35 AM
      Thanks for the warning, Dennis. The base coat is Rust-oleum and everything I’ve read says it must have at least a week’s drying time before being clear coated.

My plan is to clear coat the wing as an experiment, to test the clear coat and to test my rebuilt compressor.

I haven’t completed the engine swap yet. I have one of my spare Quads installed in the car, but I haven’t modified the two wiring harnesses yet, plumbed the fuel lines/radiator hoses, etc. I have all the parts for the rebuild of my HO Quad but I want to finish the paint job and the interior first.


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #117, 07-16-2019 10:52 PM
      I finally got some time to prep and clear coat the car. Wish I could have done it during the winter or early spring, because summer in Oklahoma and spraying a car in an un-air conditioned shop do NOT mix.

I sprayed one coat on Sunday, then a second coat last night, because the can says to wait at least 6 hours between coats. I'm very happy with the results. I did get some orange peel on parts of the car, but it's much less noticeable than orange peel in the color coat was.



More than 50% of the car came out glassy smooth (with some minor imperfections). The instructions on the can say I can sand and buff the clear, but I have to wait 14 days. One good thing about the heat we're having now, it should help the clear cure completely.



Painting a car in a garage in the summer in Oklahoma has many drawbacks, not least of which is the uninvited guests.



I used Majic clear coat that I found at Tractor Supply. I decided to use it after reading the guidelines on the company site. I figure if it's tough enough for farm equipment it's tough enough for a Fiero. It's ready to spray right out of the gallon can, too.

https://www.tractorsupply.c...s-laquer-clear-1-gal

I read somewhere that overspray is much worse with clear than it is with color and I confirmed that. This stuff made a thick cloud that took a long time to dissipate. I was glad I went to the trouble to hang plastic again. This time around I used a box of clingy drop cloths. They're made to be ripped off one at a time, but I left them attached to make a solid wall all the way around the car.

The downside was that while applying the first coat, the plastic came in contact with parts of the car. The second coat eliminated most of those blemishes.

I have some other tasks to complete in the shop while I'm waiting for the clear to cure. Next up will be installing the sun roof and the headliner, then removing the dash to add the harness for the power equipment in the doors. While the dash is out I will refurbish and modify it, adding drink holders and possibly a glove compartment.


Quad Raider (richard.clark@griffin.news) MSG #118, 07-16-2019 10:58 PM
      The other good news is that my friend sold the truck from hell, so I'll never have to deal with it again.

Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #119, 09-14-2019 09:20 AM
      This is the Fiero owner formerly known as Quad Raider. After updating my email address, I couldn’t log in as Quad Raider. I tried everything I could think of to solve the problem and finally just created another log-in. I like Quadfather better than Quad Raider, anyway.

As far as the car goes, I’ve installed the sunroof, after installing new stainless tracks and and a new seal. I’ll post photos soon.

I’m now working on upholstering the headliner, which has turned into its own ordeal.


Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #120, 09-19-2019 10:15 AM
      I've made significant progress over the last few months with the biggest accomplishment being the installation of the sunroof and hardware. In 2014 I ordered a set of stainless steel tracks from silver 85 sc. His kits are great because they come with all the rivets, washers and nuts required for the installation.

Tip: it's easier to install all the rivets if the roof panel isn't bolted down yet. I pried up the panel about two inches and could reach underneath it to hold the rivets while installed the track. I decided not to use all the rivets provided in the kit because I used sealant to glue the tracks to the roof panel.

The hardest part of the job was finding all the parts that I removed from the salvage yard cars, including the metal hinge clips.






I bought a new seal from the Fiero Store. It had been in a box since 2014 and had a kink in it, so I clipped it to a wire and let it hang in the shop for a few days to try to straighten it out.



Getting the seal to fit inside the track was a challenge. Because I worked from one end to the other, I accidentally stretched the rubber so that the seal was too long for the track.



I pulled it out and started over, installing the edges first and working toward the center, being careful not to stretch the rubber. The final result looks pretty good.



[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 09-19-2019).]

Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #121, 09-19-2019 10:22 AM
      Next up was installing the sunroof latch. I looked all over the shop for the two special bolts but couldn't find them, so I used a couple carriage bolts to make my own.



About two minutes after I finished installing the latch, I was cleaning up and found the factory bolts on one of my extra latches.



I decided to use my homemade bolts and save these factory ones in case I ever do this again.


Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #122, 09-19-2019 10:31 AM
      With the sunroof installed, the next big step is installing the headliner. The problem is I don't have a decent backer board for a sunroof car. I ended up piecing together one from parts of three broken ones I picked up at the salvage over the years. Just like everything else, it's turned out to be much more work than I planned. I tried fiberglassing just the joints, but have since decided to fiberglass the whole thing. I haven't had a chance to buy more resin and fabric.

In the meantime, I also removed the dash to install the wiring harness for the power windows/locks/mirrors and to clean up the dash and fabricate a glove box/drink holders.





This procedure was pretty easy, thanks to the instructions on this forum and the fact that I've removed a couple dashes from salvage yard cars. My dash is actually in pretty good shape. It has some small cracks in the bottom corners but is mostly just dirty.

You can see my Frankensteined headliner board in the background.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 09-19-2019).]

David Hambleton (david.hambleton@cogeco.ca) MSG #123, 09-19-2019 11:54 AM
      Did you consider a new headliner?

https://www.fierostore.com/...rowse.aspx?d=264&p=1


Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #124, 09-19-2019 01:13 PM
      I did but I just can't justify spending that much money for one.

Habanera Hal (halspalter1@aol.com) MSG #125, 09-19-2019 02:08 PM
     

Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #126, 09-19-2019 05:27 PM
      Here's more information about the mount for the sunroof latch.

The bolts have square heads and are attached to thin pieces of steel that fit into the holes in the roof.





I bought some small carriage bolts and ground down the heads far enough so that they'd fit through the holes. I used nylock nuts to bolt on the latch. I'd spent a lot of time over a couple of days looking around the shop trying to find the factory bolts. When I finally finished installing my homemade ones, I found the two factory bolts in my box of extra latches.



I thought about replacing the homemade ones with these factory bolts, but the homemade ones worked fine and I like the idea of having some spares for whatever reason, so I packed these away.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 09-19-2019).]

Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #127, 09-26-2019 05:02 PM
      Haven't had much time to work on the car, but I did fiberglass the headliner last weekend. Tuesday night I spent some time trimming the excess cloth and sanding the surface smooth. I didn't have a section of cloth large enough to cover the whole board, so I had to make a seam along the surface near the back edge. That led to a rough spot that needed to be sanded down.





It looks rough but it's actually fairly smooth. I found headliner material on sale at Hobby Lobby and bought a big chunk for $11. I'm hoping the foam on the back of it will hide all of the imperfections.

I hope to get time in the next couple of days to glue the fabric to the board and then install the board.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 09-26-2019).]

Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #128, 09-30-2019 09:22 PM
      Headliner installed, sort of. I was looking around the internet a couple of weeks ago and came across this video on YouTube, which I found very helpful:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DdTl01qI-mo

The best tip in the video is using the backer board as a pattern to mark the areas on the fabric where adhesive should be sprayed. I used Permatex headliner adhesive.



I couldn't tell from the video how much extra material to leave in the sunroof opening so I went with about 2".


My Frankesteined backer board gave me problems along the edges of the sunroof opening. I guess when I fiberglassed the pieces together I didn't get enough arch in them, so that part of the backer board sits too low once it's installed in the car.

I also couldn't figure out how to work the corners of the sunroof opening. You can't cut them, so it takes some work to get the fabric to stretch to be pushed into the gap and the plastic trim/holder pressed into place. I ended up using a rubber hammer to seat the plastic.



It's not perfect but I'm satisfied for now. I could see taking it apart at some point and making a backer board from scratch that will fit perfectly.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 09-30-2019).]

Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #129, 09-30-2019 09:28 PM
      I really need to pull the console skeleton out to rebuild it, but it's so dirty and broken I'm having trouble getting motivated. I did dig out the other interior parts from the shelf. They're worse than I remember them, especially the console door. About half the vinyl has pulled apart from the plastic, so I began the process of gluing it back, one edge at a time. I'm also gluing the door arm rests and the center console upright.

The plastic tabs on the inside of the A pillar trim pieces broke off, so I'm gluing the steel clips to the inside. I managed to get three of the four plastic clips out of the holes without breaking them. Guess an order from the Fiero Store will be happening soon.

(sorry for the blurry photo but I was in a hurry to close up the shop and go home)

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 10-08-2019).]

Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #130, 09-30-2019 09:33 PM
      Here's a pleasant surprise from the console box. It's some of the original paperwork from the previous owner, who bought the car new in June of 1987.

When she took delivery on 6/24/1987, the car had 10 miles on it. Included with the paperwork are the knockouts from the keys, in case I ever need to order replacements.



Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #131, 10-08-2019 08:30 AM
      Working on the interior pieces. It's a very slow process. On some pieces it's only possible to glue one edge at a time, so I decided to clean and paint the trim. I'm using Rust-oleum Smoke Gray, which I think looks great. We'll see how it looks once the parts are back in the car.



My console and skeleton were in bad shape, so I'm using parts I got out of an '88 in the salvage in Wichita. I was on vacation last week, so I had time to make the 3-hour drive over there. Just like my original console, the mounting ears were broken off on the salvage yard one, so I made replacements out of some thin sheet metal.






Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #132, 10-08-2019 08:49 AM
      I finally did remove the skeleton and it was in even worse shape than I thought. Don't know why GM used such brittle plastic for this part.



There were some surprises underneath:



No idea how seeds could get up inside there. Maybe mice left them. Notice how much the carpets have faded. I hadn't looked closely at them since I had them out of the car to pressure wash them five or six years ago. They'll be coming out again in the next few days so I can finish cleaning up the interior, but I can't afford to replace them just yet.

Then found this plug pushed down under the right side of the console toward the front of the car. Covered in grease and taped inside a plastic bag.





Haven't had the chance to look over the area to see what it plugs into, but Facebook says it's for the door buzzer.

As expected, the wiring for the aftermarket radio is pretty messy.



I checked this radio to make sure it worked before pulling the duke and associated wiring out of the car. It has an auxiliary jack and a remote, but I'm leaning toward replacing it with a new one that's got bluetooth. I saw somebody post this Crutchfield parts list on Facebook and I may use the same one.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 10-08-2019).]

Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #133, 10-08-2019 09:02 AM
      Working on the area under the console gave me some time to just sit in the car and look at the headliner. It just doesn't fit as well as I want it to, so I will pull it out and do it over again.

 
quote
Originally posted by Quadfather:





The opening for the sunroof is about 3/4" too big and the sides don't have the proper curvature to fit the inside of the roof. I also cut the latch opening too big.



Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #134, 10-08-2019 09:51 AM
      Since the interior is out of the car, I'll be replacing the stock shifter cables with a set I got out of a V6/5-speed car in the salvage five years ago. I didn't mark the cables when I pulled them out of the donor car, so I don't know which one is which. The original cables are covered by rubber hoses in the engine compartment. These V6 cables had some worn out heat shields so I just cut them off.

I did notice the grommet is bigger on one of the salvage yard cables, same goes for the cable in the car.



The exhaust manifold faces the back of the car on the Quad, so the shifter cables will be fine unshielded.

It's been a few years since I tinkered with the shifter cables and related hardware so I don't remember all the details. I was in the middle of fabricating my own shifter cable brackets for my GTZ Getrag when a V6/5-speed Fiero showed up in one of my local salvage yards so I grabbed these cables.

I don't know how anyone else's brain works in a project like this, but for me it's like spinning plates. I study up on each phase, then start the work. If too much time passes between the studying and the work, I have to do the studying all over again because some of the plates have fallen off the sticks.

The good news, since I'm now dealing with shifter cables it means working on the Quad and finishing the swap is getting nearer.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 10-08-2019).]

Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #135, 10-15-2019 05:44 PM
      Only had a little time over the weekend to work on the car, so I spent most of it epoxying the console skeleton. While the epoxy was curing, I pulled the stock shifter cables out to compare them to the salvage yard set. In this photo the stock Isuzu cables are on the bottom. They're quite a bit longer than the V-6 Getrag cables.



The shift select cable attaches much lower on the Getrag than the Isuzu cable does, so it has to make a sharp 90-degree turn, which requires it to be much longer than the shift cable.



Disappointed to find some damage to the casing in the select cable I bought from the salvage yard.



Haven't decided what to do about it yet. Rodney Dickman sells some nice ones, but at 140 bucks a pop they're pricey. I'll see if I can clean this one up and replace the damaged casing with something.

I also removed my newly reupholstered headliner and ripped the fabric off. Once I scrape and vacuum the foam off, I'll set about cutting it up and making sure it's the right size and shape. I bought more headliner material but had to get black because Hobby Lobby was out of gray.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 11-26-2019).]

Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #136, 11-18-2019 09:28 PM
      Well, a month has gone by with hardly any progress. I’ve been busy with family events and refereeing soccer games. Over the weekend the Union Pacific #4014 Big Boy steam locomotive came through Oologah and spent the night just up the highway in Coffeyville, so we took advantage of the historic tour.

I did fix the damaged shifter cable and also bought some more tools, but haven’t spent any time on the car. Soccer season is over so I have my weekends back.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 11-25-2019).]

Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #137, 11-20-2019 09:54 AM
      Got some time in the shop last night. Spent most of the time figuring out where I'd left off in October. Here's how I fixed the broken cover on the shift cable. First, I cut off the broken plastic, then wired brushed the steel braid, then sprayed the braid with this stuff.





Then I wrapped the steel with a layer of this sealing tape, then wrapped the repair with a wider piece. The gray stuff on the cable is residue from my first failed attempt.





I don't remember what this tape is called, but it works great. Getting the tape off after deciding I didn't like the first try was really tough.



Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #138, 11-20-2019 10:13 AM
      I also reinstalled the shifter and the V6 cables.



The shift cable has to be routed over the intake manifold and then down to the shift lever.



The V6 shift cable bracket has to be tweaked. One bolt hole will work, but the second hole on the GTZ Getrag doesn't line up with the one on the bracket. Plus, the mounting holes for the slave cylinder aren't needed. I'll fix this later when I have the engine cradle out of the car.




The V6 select cable linkage requires a change to the collar on the lever. The collar needs to be rotated 180 degrees so the slot faces the rear of the car.




I think I can drive this pin out, turn the collar and reinstall, but it will have to wait until I have the cradle out of the car again.




As you can see, the pin that rides in the slot is on the side facing the back of the car. The slot on the GTZ transmission faces the front.


I had fabricated my own shift select bracket a few years ago when I found a V6 manual car in the salvage yard. You can see the difference in the pin location.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 11-20-2019).]

Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #139, 11-20-2019 10:27 AM
      I did my yearly physical provided by my company, which means an excuse to visit the LKQ yard in Oklahoma City. I found 4th-generation Camaro seat covers in better condition than the ones I've already installed.



I'll probably wait to install them until I'm done with the interior, so as not to stain or damage them.


Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #140, 11-20-2019 10:30 AM
      Here's the reason I didn't get any work done last weekend. The Union Pacific locomotive #4014 Big Boy came through my hometown, then spent the night just up the road in Coffeyville, Kansas. I'd seen it in Nebraska in August and it was worth seeing it again.





It's now headed across Kansas into Colorado as it wraps up this tour. You should see it if you can.


Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #141, 11-24-2019 10:58 AM
      Spent some time in the shop yesterday trying to sort out the shift linkage. I used a spare FWD Getrag to test removing the pin from the shift collar, then decided to try it on the transmission that's in the Fiero. The roll pin is a tight fit.



I had to move stuff out of the way to be able to swing the hammer to hit the punch, but it worked. When I installed the select linkage, I discovered a problem.



The loop on the engine side of the shift select lever hits the tranmission case, preventing the lever from moving the rod in.


I'm considering cutting off the loop, where the tape is in this photo, and welding in a piece of metal where the piece of wood is, or maybe on the other side of the hinge, closer to the shift rod.



Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #142, 11-24-2019 11:03 AM
      The other issue to address is mounting the bracket for the select cable. The GTZ Getrag only has one boss and bolt hole where the Fiero Getrag has two. These photos are from a spare Quad 4 transmission sitting on the floor in the shop.




I know I've seen photos of how others have solved this, but I'll have to look around the internet to refresh my memory. IIRC, the process involves welding a flange onto the bracket that will allow it to use one of the bolts for the inspection cover on the end of the transmission.

SIDE NOTE: This transmission came from a Quad 4 enthusiast in New Mexico. Five or six years ago I saw a post on the Quad 4 forum from him, saying he didn't need this transmission anymore and wanted it to go to a good home, for free. One of my brothers was about to take a trip out west, including a drive through New Mexico, so we worked it out for him to bring it back for me. Unfortunately, we made all the arrangements via the Quad 4 forum, which is no longer accessible, so I don't remember what vehicle the transmission came out of or even his name. I'm pretty sure it came out of a 442. I'm not planning to use it in this swap, but that may change. In the very least, it's helpful to have a second transmission that's out of a car to use as a model.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 11-24-2019).]

Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #143, 11-24-2019 11:09 AM
      I also scraped the foam from my first attempt at upholstering my Frankenstein headliner backer board. What a mess.



As I mentioned, I pieced this backer board together from parts of three salvage yard boards. I didn't get the dimensions just right, but I also didn't get the shape and curvature right, either. You can see one of the problems in this photo.



I'll be working on this today. I'm on vacation this week and the weather looks good, so I'm hoping to make good progress on the interior.


Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #144, 11-27-2019 10:28 AM
      Progress. I cut then welded the select lever.




When I checked the fit, I found a new problem. The lever hit the mounting flange, so I cut out a section of the flange then welded a small piece of metal down its length to reinforce what was left.





Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #145, 11-27-2019 10:41 AM
      I modified the select cable bracket to fit the GTZ Getrag.



When I installed everything on the transmission, I discovered a problem. The mount put the select cable end about 2" too short of the select lever.



The reason for this was something very obvious that I'd just missed. The GTZ transmission only has one boss for a bracket. Years ago I'd seen how Sardonyx had handled this in his thread. His Quad Getrag has the same two bosses as the Fiero, they just needed to be tapped:

 
quote
Originally posted by sardonyx247:




For the side bracket the holes are there, but not tapped out, They have to be drilled out a little and then tapped.
Make sure to use a good quality tap, like Craftsman, the cheap Harbor Freight taps make the hole a bit bigger and then the bolts are loose.





The lower side bracket on.


[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 11-27-2019).]

Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #146, 11-27-2019 10:51 AM
      I guess GM used some different Getrag cases with Quad engines over the years. To fix this, I changed the size and shape of the extra metal I welded to the bracket.
To get the right mounting position, I moved the linkage from the engine side while watching the shifter through the back window.





With everything installed, I sat in the seat and shifted the transmission. The select cable side of it felt pretty stiff so I will likely replace it with a Rodney Dickman cable. The shift cable side worked perfectly.


Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #147, 11-27-2019 11:03 AM
      Then I moved back to the headliner. After careful consideration, I decided the best way to fix it was to cut the side pieces off.



I mounted the front and rear pieces in the car, then trimmed the side pieces to fit. I discovered the right side was about a half-inch longer than the driver's side, which was also about an eighth of an inch too long. To put them back together I used some duct tape that I found at work. Somehow it's even stickier than regular duct tape.

I also ground down the joints I'd fiberglassed together, and added some curvature.





When I get over to the shop this morning, I will either duct tape the whole backer board or get out the fiberglass resin again. Either way, I want to reupholster it and get it back in the car today.


FIERO JOHN-WI (podziemj@matc.edu) MSG #148, 11-27-2019 01:55 PM
      FYI if you want more info on quad fours, here is a lot of 4 manuals 2 of them on Quad four.. cheap..
https://www.ebay.com/itm/174108780902


Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #149, 12-01-2019 10:10 PM
      I fiberglassed the joints of the backer board. A couple hammers and a jack helped hold it in place.





Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #150, 12-01-2019 10:15 PM
      I sanded and shaped the backer board to get it ready for the fabric. While attaching the fabric I made a big wrinkle, so I just ripped it all off and will have to get more tomorrow.

On the shift linkage front, here's what it looks like installed.



[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 12-01-2019).]

Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #151, 12-13-2019 05:35 PM
      Test.

I’m having trouble logging in on my Android phone, so I’ve switched to the iPad.

I ordered a new select cable from Rodney and installed it today. Shifting through the gears is much easier now (of course, it’s without the clutch pedal hooked up to the slave cylinder).





[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 12-13-2019).]

Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #152, 12-13-2019 05:58 PM
      I tried gluing a new section of headliner material onto the backer board and screwed it up yet again. I’ll get some more material tomorrow. I figured out what I was doing wrong.

Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #153, 12-23-2019 08:42 PM
      I reupholstered the headliner backer board and got it installed. It fits much better now.










[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 12-23-2019).]

Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #154, 12-23-2019 08:57 PM
      I’ve been working on installing the wiring harnesses for the power windows, locks and mirrors. Here’s a separate thread I started about connecting the harnesses to power:

http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/099136.html

I finally figured out that I need to connect the two wires I’m holding here to the similarly colored wires attached to the fuse block. I already added the 30 amp breakers to the fuse block years ago, when I first bought the power doors and wiring harnesses from a salvage yard car.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 12-23-2019).]

Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #155, 12-23-2019 09:11 PM
      The passenger side installation was even easier. There’s a circle cut in the sound insulation and a screw hole drilled in the space frame to mount the junction block at the other end of the harness.





While I was in there I saw that my car doesn’t have a blue dingy thingy.




I’m also considering taking the shroud off to look at the heater core. Wouldn’t hurt to replace it while I have the dash out.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 12-23-2019).]

tmadia (tkmadone@gmail.com) MSG #156, 12-24-2019 12:29 PM
      Great thread! You are doing a fantastic job and that's going to be a really fun car when you are done!

Just curious, why did you decide to go with the Camaro seats over the Cavalier seats? Also, do you remember what year the Cav seats were?


Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #157, 12-24-2019 03:48 PM
     
 
quote
Originally posted by tmadia:

Great thread! You are doing a fantastic job and that's going to be a really fun car when you are done!

Just curious, why did you decide to go with the Camaro seats over the Cavalier seats? Also, do you remember what year the Cav seats were?


That is really nice of you to say. Thank you.

I like the Camaro seats better than the Cavalier seats because the Camaro seats are almost exactly the same dimensions as the Fiero seats. The Cavalier seat bases are wider but not as deep as the Camaro seats, so I didn’t like how they fit in the car and they didn’t support my legs very well. I don’t remember what year the car was that I removed them from, but I think ‘96 or ‘97. I was looking at a lot of different types of seats back then and they all run together.

EDIT: They were out of a ‘99 Cavalier.

Fiero seat on the left, Cavalier on the right:

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 12-24-2019).]

Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #158, 12-24-2019 03:56 PM
      I am certain the Quad 4 will be GREAT in the Fiero. When my GTZ was still on the road, I had a different job at my company which had me attending a meeting at another location every two weeks. Driving back to work from that meeting involved using one particular highway on-ramp to get back to the office. I’d start up that on-ramp at about 15 mph and by the time I was ready to merge a few seconds later I’d be doing 75. Every, single, time.

My responsibilities at work changed and I didn’t have to go to that meeting again. After 10 years and another job title change, I had the occasion to take that same on-ramp about a month ago. I was in a company vehicle, but those GTZ/Quad 4 memories came rushing back. Made me want to finish this swap/restoration even more.


Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #159, 12-24-2019 09:25 PM
      I’ve set the wiring issue aside for now, mostly because I’m hesitant to hack into the car’s original wiring. Instead, I started work on the door panels. I bought a set of power window door panels from a salvage yard car a few years ago. As usual, they’re in worse shape than I thought when I bought them.

It appears the passenger side one got wet, so the bottom part of the backer board is very flimsy. I saw someone else’s post about removing the carpet using a heat gun and elbow grease, so that’s what I did.







Took at least 30 minutes to heat the carpet and pry it off while doing as little damage to the backer as possible.



I then put a layer of fiberglass cloth across the bottom 5 inches of the back side and glued it on. We’ll see how it looks tomorrow.

While Christmas shopping for my wife at Hobby Lobby today, I bought some black vinyl material that I plan to use to replace the carpet. More to come.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 12-24-2019).]

Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #160, 12-28-2019 10:32 PM
      More progress on the door panels. One needed a lot of fiberglass because of water damage, the other one needed some help around the mounting holes for the plastic clips that hold it to the door. I cut small pieces of fiberglass cloth for each one. A Dremel made quick work of opening up all the holes once the resin cured.



[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 12-28-2019).]

Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #161, 12-28-2019 10:45 PM
      The project was delayed because I had to replace a window regulator on my wife’s Grand Prix. I’ve been trying to come up with a good idea for drink holders for the dash, and yesterday while driving to the salvage yard I had an epiphany. I realized the drink holders from a 2002 LeSabre would be perfect. I know this because my daily driver is a 2002 LeSabre I inherited from my mom.

The LeSabre drink holder is attached to the front of the fold-down armrest. Once I got to the salvage I checked it out and saw that it pops right off and has a flat surface on the back which would make it easy to attach to the Fiero dash where that bizarre pocket thing is. My car had the even stranger half pocket, which was ripped and ugly.

Another plus for this drink holder is that it disassembles, making a change of color easy to apply. I bought the best parts from two different salvage yard cars, which explains the different colors in these photos, for a whopping $8.



This afternoon I played around with some two-sided tape to see where I should install it on the dash.





I like the way it looks. I’m thinking I’ll cut a piece of plywood to fit in the recess of the dash, then fiberglass it and sand it smooth, then attach the drink holder with two small bolts. I plan to paint the dash and drink holder Rust-Oleum smoke gray.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 12-28-2019).]

Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #162, 12-29-2019 07:06 PM
      Ever since visiting the salvage yard on Friday, I’ve been thinking about a different kind of upholstery on the door panels. I think the black vinyl I already bought would look fine, but while browsing in the salvage yard I saw a 4th gen Camaro with the two-tone seats like I have. For the first time, I noticed that interior has a section of gray cloth on the door panels to match the seats. I found very similar fabric on Amazon, so I think I’ll order some.

The darker gray would look good.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 12-29-2019).]

Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #163, 12-29-2019 07:13 PM
      Five years ago, before discovering the compatibility of 4th gen Camaro seats, I was planning to reupholster my factory seats, so I bought a bunch of fabric. Today it was too cold to open the shop doors, so that meant no spray painting, so I tried using some of that fabric to reupholster the speaker covers. The fabric is velour so it’s probably not the best choice, but the process turned out to be so simple I can find some better fabric and do it again.



That white blob on the dash is a repair I’m working on. I must have dropped something on the dash while I was working on the door panels, because there was a golf ball-size impact point there. Hobby Lobby sells vinyl in a tube, but the cracks are so bad I’m having to layer the stuff on. It appears to be working, but still needs a few more coats.



Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #164, 12-29-2019 07:19 PM
      For weeks I’d been planning to take the access panel off and check the heater core for leaks, but today someone posted on the Fiero Facebook group about how easy it is to change, so I took the cue and checked. Has to be one of the easiest heater cores to access.

At first glance I thought mine was good, but then noticed evidence of small leaks.





The rest of the ducting looks good, just a little dusty.





Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #165, 12-29-2019 07:23 PM
      Still trying to work up the courage to splice the power window/locks harness into the car’s harness. Probably will do that this week. In the meantime, I’ll keep working on getting the dash and related parts ready for reassembly.

Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #166, 01-06-2020 06:31 PM
      While shopping the salvage yard for the window regulator for my wife’s car, I saw a couple Camaros with the same kind of upholstery as my seats and made a note to get back to strip the rear seats.

Thursday night my son hit a deer while driving the car. This is the third time deer have hit the car. I knew from my visit to the salvage earlier in the week there’s another 40th anniversary Grand Prix in the lot, so my son and I went and got the hood and the other parts we needed.




The replacement hood is banged up but still much better than the deer-damaged one.



This car has 225,000 miles on it and the body is just not worth saving, but we need it to be driveable for another six months or so. At that point I will remove the engine, trans, computer and harness for eventual use in another Fiero.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 01-06-2020).]

Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #167, 01-06-2020 06:39 PM
      While at the salvage we also bought two rear seat covers from the 4th gen Camaros for a whopping $9.



One cover was in great shape, the other one not so much. It was faded and the carpet-like fabric that covers the back of the rear seat just crumbled. You might be able to tell that it was a bit faded, too.



I used the faded one for my first try, which was on the passenger door panel. I’ll keep looking for more 4th gen Camaros in the salvage with this kind of upholstery and grab another back seat cover, then re-do this door.



I like the look. I ran out of time in the shop, so I’ll try to do the other side this week. I’ll also try to take photos of the cutting and upholstery process. I think I’ll paint the vinyl parts of the panels a darker gray to get them to match the fabric.

While test fitting this panel to the door, I noticed the top part has been mis-shaped, probably from sitting around so long. I set it up with some clamps to straighten it out. I also took a close look at my inner dew wipes and unsurprisingly they need to be replaced. There’s no money in the budget right now for dew wipes or a heater core, so I’ll keep working on things that don’t cost much until I can afford those parts.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 01-06-2020).]

Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #168, 01-06-2020 07:11 PM
      I did replace the clutch safety switch. Earlier in this thread I noted how the previous owner had put a jumper in the plug for the switch. The car has never run since I bought it, so I don’t know for sure but it’s a safe bet the switch was bad.

I figured replacing the switch while the dash was out would be much easier. A couple years ago I came across a thread on here that the Fiero switches aren’t available anymore so the poster used one from an ‘88 S10 Blazer.

http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/133653.html

I ordered the S10 switch from RockAuto and sure enough, the switches look almost identical.



The S10 switch has an extra pickup, but that doesn’t matter. The biggest difference is that the rods move in opposite directions. It’s simple to put the Fiero rod and adjustment clip into the S10 switch from the proper direction. I then mounted the switch and used the clip to adjust the travel while moving the pedal. Definitely easier to do while the dash is out of the car.

Note: the S10 adjustment clip will not work on the Fiero push rod. The teeth on the Fiero clip don’t fit the S10 rod, so just use both the Fiero rod and clip.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 01-06-2020).]

Skatulaki MSG #169, 01-06-2020 10:13 PM
      I've really enjoyed your posts, I'm just beginning to do pretty much what you have done, sans engine upgrade. I hope you wont mind referencing what you have done, to rebuild my Fiero

Thanks


Quadfather (918raider@gmail.com) MSG #170, 01-06-2020 10:38 PM
     
 
quote
Originally posted by Skatulaki:

I've really enjoyed your posts, I'm just beginning to do pretty much what you have done, sans engine upgrade. I hope you wont mind referencing what you have done, to rebuild my Fiero

Thanks


That would be great. Feel free to post your own build thread so everyone else can see what you’re up to.